Unleashing Mental Force

Discussion in 'Ages 30-39' started by trapped7, Jan 18, 2013.

  1. trapped7

    trapped7 "what you resist persists"

    Re: unleashing the real me

    Day 87

    It's funny how I was always the first to stress the importance of abstaining from M completely during the reboot because M would lead to more craving and escalation.

    Now that I have M almost every day during the last week I am witnessing how my behaviour is escalting - I'm drawn to pics with girls in lingerie and occasional topless pics - and I'm rationalising about how it's not P, and how therefore it's alright if I just keep it brief and so on.

    Why is it that I absolutely believe in a concept - namely that M always leads to escalation - and end up still doing it at some point, and why is it that I'm then even a little surprised when I get triggers and urges after almost 3 months of abstaining from P?

    It's the power of the addiction and I am a recovering addict.

    I have made some progress, namely that I went from 3 to 6 PMO sessions a day to not watching P at all for almost 3 months, but now I have to be really careful to not relapse. I don't want all of this time and effort to be for nothing.

    I did 65 days of no M, and it wasn't much of a problem, and now it seems I can go for more than 2 days w/out M. This is ridiculous

    So, starting now I will not MO nor look at borderline content for 10 days, and I won't deviate.
    This seems like a reasonable goal right now, if I said I were not to ever MO again I just wouldn't believe myself and thus not hold myself accountable.

    Please wish me luck, I feel this is a critical point in my recovery.
  2. Gil79

    Gil79 Seize the day

    Re: unleashing the real me

    I know what you mean very well. I've been in these edging, MO-ing (but no PMO-ing) states for a long time. In my case I could only stop it when I eventually PMO-ed. It's like your brain found a way around it and still kind of gets what he craves for and thereby increases the chance for a complete (PMO) relapse.

    I've never been able to turn it around. Regarding the fact that you got this far before you got into this state of M-ing, I think you can do it. Maybe you can mark this period in some sort of way. Like you remember this day that you decided to take a deep breath and continue the journey. Maybe you could go for a daylong hike or something like that. Something that brings you close to yourself and you can think about with positivity.

    You know you can do it
  3. A New Man

    A New Man White Knuckle Brigade 2013

    Re: unleashing the real me

    I'm at the exactly same place- around 85 days and on the verge of relapse. I wonder if we are not at a stage in the reboot when the libido is fully recharged but the addicted brain has no way of dealing with it other than MO or PMO. IMO this is the point we've got to start rewiring to the real thing or risk fall back into the old ways. Hang in there man and rewire whenever you get the chance. Your full reboot/rewire might be just around the corner.

    The darkest hour is just before the dawn, as they say.

    Reboot. Rewire.
  4. trapped7

    trapped7 "what you resist persists"

    Re: unleashing the real me

    Day 88

    Had intense urges and fantasies upon waking up. It took quite some willpower to surf these.
    In a way this feels like the beginning of my reboot, only this time I don't get urges and triggers to look at P, but to MO and fantasize.

    Gil, thanks for saying you believe that I'll be able to turn this around. I believe so too and right now I'm determined to keep walking this path and to complete my little "no M and no looking at borderline material for 10 days" challenge!

    True, I agree and until Day 65 I was adopting the monk attitude as well. I second that this ascetic approach is the only one that works, if we allow ourselves to engage in M and borderline material the reboot is compromised and the behaviour will ultimately lead to a slip.
    What to is so astonishing about it is that I was quite aware about this from the beginning of the reboot but _still_ couldn't keep myself from engaging in these 2 dangerous activites. Thanks for having faith in me, right now it's important that I focus on not M one day at a time.

    ANM, good to hear I'm not alone with this around this timeframe in the reboot. I agree, my libido has definitely returned to a more healthy state, despite not having fully normalised yet. And like you said, my system doesn't seem to know how to handle it.
    In my opinion the days when it gets really tough are when the actual transformation happens. If we then give in to the addiction we really detain ourselves from any progress.
    Therefore I think it's imperative that we learn to face the urges during these times without giving in.
  5. trapped7

    trapped7 "what you resist persists"

    Re: unleashing the real me

    Day 89

    Once again urges upon waking up, again I was able to surf them.

    I'm trying to accept my past and the fact that I wasn't nearly as active as I could have been in the last 10+ years. I didn't know any better. I didn't know what I should have done.
    I'm trying to see what I should do now, so I'm not gonna say the same thing again 10 years from now.

    I have to let go of the wish for certain experiences and a certain career, and at the same time I need to see that I'm young enough to guide my life into a new direction, possibly go abroad for a while, to meet many new people and make fulfilling experiences.

    I also would like to let go more, think and ponder less and let life guide me.

    True, yes you're right. MO is obviously not needed for survival, yet our unbalanced brain can create a strong pull towards it. And yes, the MO will never satisfy the urges, but instead make us crave for more.

    I second your set of rules, and I agree that while complete abstinence from O seems like a high price, it is much better than remaining caught in the dark place of addiction.
  6. trapped7

    trapped7 "what you resist persists"

    Re: unleashing the real me

    Day 90

    Same thing, the triggers to M are the most intense in the very morning. I'm glad I was again able to walk away from it.

    Trying to do something about the procrastination.
    The very first thing I will do daily in the very morning from now on is to make a ToDo list of the things I can come up with, then prioritize them and, most importantly, start working on them.

    Also whenever I find myself starting to run around in circles in my apartment I'll do a default activity as soon as I recognize that.
    - cleaning my apartment (there's always something I can do here)
    - do a work-out if I haven't already done so.
    - beginn working on one of the tasks on the list.

    This procrastination is, as I have said before, just another means to avoid anxiety.
    I want to be more active and risk more, while at the same time letting go and detaching myself from the outcome.
    This I want to be one of my new core approaches to my everyday life.

    It's easy however to fall back into familiar patterns of avoidance, as soon as the fears start to come up.

    True, what exactly do you mean when you say this seperates the past and current me - I guess you mean it's what can make me let go of my past and move beyond it? We'll take this crucial steps. Whenever we fall back into patterns of avoidance we'll be able to see it and go for it again.
  7. trapped7

    trapped7 "what you resist persists"

    Re: unleashing the real me

    Day 91

    More of the same. still no MO. but I checked out borderline material twice again.

    I'm still addicted to borderline material. I couldn't get myself to not look. I have enough willpower to stay away from P and - for the time being - from MO, but it seems I can't stay away from borderline material.

    Now I know this "P light" still releases Dopamine in my unbalanced system, which is not what I want in terms of recovery. I do see that this material excites me more than hardcore P did back in the day, which is probably a good thing.
    But, I know watching this stuff is slowing down my reboot and presumably delaying the next wave of emotional hardship I'll have to go through anyway if I continue on this road of recovery from the addiction.

    I'm learning.
    What will help me more than resisting this is to acknowledge that I have made progress in these past months.

    And writing about these obliquities everytime they occur will also help I'm sure, even if I have to repeat myself over and over again.
  8. trapped7

    trapped7 "what you resist persists"

    Re: unleashing the real me

    Day 92

    Imsomnia. woke up at 4:30 AM and got up after a while.
    again edging and escalating to borderline material... still no MO.

    True, I agree, repeating ourselves in writing down the challenges we face is not a problem. I can only write from the point I'm at anyway.

    Your advise is sound, as usual. However, I can't find the strength or inner conviction to include borderline material into the off-limits things at this point. what I do observe is this: although I know it's probably detrimental to my recovery and slowing it down, for the most part, I don't care.
    This is obviously addictive behaviour.

    As with P I feel I need to get to a point where I can see how damaging this stuff really is. With P it was pretty clear, once I really understood how it was affecting me I didn't really want to watch it anymore. I'd get triggers for some time, yes - but my inner conviction was so strong that until now it didn't feel like an option again.

    Some time ago a more experienced rebooter wrote that he would always tell himself how "this isn't P" when looking at borderline material. He said that at some point he realized it doesn't matter if it's P, topless girls, or a catalog with lingerie models, because it _only_ depends on what your brain does with it.

    I know it's true. But still this insight doesn't have that kind of impact on me that would prevent me from looking at it.

    Right now I feel the only thing I can do is to keep my awareness about it high and stay alert. I can't resist it.

    Resistance doesn't bring about change. Awareness does.
  9. trapped7

    trapped7 "what you resist persists"

    Re: unleashing the real me

    It _is_ a craving for dopamine in my brain. I realise that. Still for some reason my inner addict is able to convince me that bordline material is ok, whereas it is of course detrimental to my recovery.

    borderline stuff is sexually charged, but it is not explicit as P is. therefore I suppose the effect on the brain it has is less damaging.

    I'm aware this is the stereotypical rationalisations of my inner addict. The addict is trying to get his dopamine rush through rationalisations that's what it is.

    I just found an article on YBOP that deals with the issue of edging. I didn't realize until now that edging over longer periods of time might be even more harmful to your recovery than the occasional MO, as it can keep the dopamine rush going for hours, whereas the O sets a limit to the dopamine spike. Some people write about how a few days of edging caused unbearable urges for them. I guess this is what brought me to where I'm at right now.
    http://www.yourbrainonporn.com/what-if-i-use-porn-without-orgasm (the content is to some extent just about the effect of edging)

    Learning effect: no more edging, especially not to borderline material. I've written this into my journal before 2 months or so ago. Well, here I am again. I went for it because I thought it would be better than to MO.

    I have a different view now. Of course the "no P and no M whatsoever" approach would be best, but if the urges become to strong, I'll rather MO than edge to borderline material again.
  10. trapped7

    trapped7 "what you resist persists"

    Re: unleashing the real me

    Day 93

    MO relapse yesterday evening and one more this morning.
    Now I'm in flatline again. Don't even feel disappointed with myself for some reason. It's like I've just lost motivation with all of this a little lately.

    True, I did see it exactly like you during the first 2 months of my reboot; there are no back doors.
    I guess my newest take comes from being swamped with the recent urges that I have created through my own behaviour plus me coming across this thread on the board.
    "the orgasm reboot" http://www.yourbrainrebalanced.com/index.php?topic=2416.0

    While I think the concept presented is effective, you maybe right that in my case it was just creating a backdoor for my inner addict.
    Since I went for 65 days without MO once, it's likely I'd be strong enough to do it again if I pulled it together.

    It all comes down to attitude, and mine has been suffering lately.

    Thanks for your comments.
  11. Gil79

    Gil79 Seize the day

    Re: unleashing the real me

    As TruettW sais: you are doing exceptionally well. Three months without P, you need to celebrate!

    Not feeling dissapointed is a positive thing. You relapsed MO-wise, but this will be an important learning experience. Maybe it means that you have to pay attention to the reasons why you edged and MOed lately. In one of your previous posts you wrote about the procrastination behaviour. Myself I don't believe it's an addiction by itself, but I do see (also for myself) that it's often concurrent to edging behaviour. I think you're avoiding negative emotions. I think there are two ways to deal with it: The first is dealing with the emotions and realizing that they are remnants of a past and thec second is to fill your life with positivity, literally making yourself feel good about yourself. With the latter one the you actually deal with your old emotions as well because you realize that they don't apply to your new positive life. Would it for instance be possible for you to take a week off? If you can fill a whle week with things you liketo do and not think about work, the urges to edge would decrease. One week of not edging or MO-ing would make you feel so good and that would give you the power to keep this up in your daily life.

    I'm sorry if I have been rambling. I just know how hard it is to deal with edging. I'm sure you will be able to deal with it. It's just a matter of time, but this year for sure! Good luck, Trapped!
  12. trapped7

    trapped7 "what you resist persists"

    Re: unleashing the real me

    Day 95

    A couple of MO slips again yesterday... but!

    Today I have found new motivation again. It's getting warmer outside, spring is coming.
    And I want to do this right.

    So I'll try to go for another MO less streak, starting now.

    During the first 10 days or so of the reboot, when I completely abstained from anything that was sexually triggering, P, borderline material, fantasies, I had the most urges, but I noticed that during the day I felt the most masculine and powerful when looking at girls and getting eye-contact from of them. It felt almost a little magical, and I was hoping that more of this was to come once I abstained from P for several months.
    Now I'm a little disappointed that I haven't permanently developed the superpowers that I've been introduced to early in my recovery.

    I guess what happened back then had probably a lot to do with the rise of testosterone in my system, and I suppose that can only happen if you don't O at all for some time.

    Well let's give it a go again and see what happens.

    True, I also feel I advanced more during the time in my reboot when I didn't MO at all. I just lost motivation, and my addict was looking for a way out. Thanks for your comment on my attitude. I'll get back on track now.

    Gil, Thanks for the support. I'm also not sure if procrastination is an addiction in itself, but it certainly functions similarly in my personal experience. It's a means of avoiding something, which is at the core of any addiction.
    I might be avoiding some negative emotions, but at the same time I'd say I'm quite proactive about this, facing a lot of it in psychotherapy, in talking with friends and in looking at these.
    Some of them maybe remnants of the past, but some are also things that are challenging right now, in the present.
    I already had a week off recently and would have been good to follow your advise to fill it out with definite activities. I did some things, but there was also some time when I was alone, and that was when I resorted to evasive behaviour like playing video games, youtubing and - on some occasions - watching borderline content.
    Next time I'll do a trip outside of the city or something - your hiking trip on your own sounded like a great idea.
    We'll sure get rid of this edging behaviour. Thanks for your comments!
  13. Gil79

    Gil79 Seize the day

    Re: unleashing the real me

    Could it be that the fact that you're facing your negative emotions now intensively (the talking and dealing with it) makes you look for distraction/ comforting this period? Dealing with these things is relieving but in the process it can also make you feel uncomfortable. Do you know the bhagavad gita? It's a (hinduistic?) book about a warrior (arjuna) going to battle. Right before the attack the enemy blows the horns very loud and then he freezes and starts being anxious. At that moment Krishna reveals himself to him and shows him the deeper meaning of life (very short description). The battle is said to represent the battle (the war within) against ones ego and the blowing of the horns is then the ego screaming and fighting to stop Arjuna from facing his fears. Myself I have encountered this a lot. At the moments I really want to change and start taking measures, I also get most afraid and long back to my 'old life'. It's a pretty interesting book. I read it some years ago and had a lot of support from it. However in the end it gets really filosophical and I found it a bit to complicated. But anyway, maybe it explains a bit what happens to you in terms of edging.

    And just keep posting as much as possible: when you (want to) watch boderline material, when you want to edge, etc. In that way you can find out why you have so much trouble with it lately. Good that spring has arrived there too. Things can only get better!
  14. trapped7

    trapped7 "what you resist persists"

    Re: unleashing the real me

    Day 96

    sexual thoughts in the morning, as expected - but right now I'm in a different mindset. no P, no M, no borderline material.

    feeling a little gloomy right now, but I do have motivation to tackle some tasks.
    We'll see how it goes.

    True, I plan to follow that advise and I'm looking forward to that testosterone peak, and the emotional state that comes with it. This is also something that fuels my motivation right now.

    Gil, yes that could of course be. and as I said in the other post, I believe the addiction - and the edging and MO are part of it - is at the core a means of avoidance. Funny, that you'd mention the bhagavad gita, coincidentally it was yesterday that I listened to a talk by the philosopher Slavoj Zizek, where he mentioned this book ( talking about how during the NS regime, Himmler would always carry the book within and refer to it to justify to himself all the cruel killings they were doing, as in looking at the world as not the ultimate reality; everyone disappears again anyeay and so on and so forth, but this is obviously a total different context and the divine book was totally misused)
    this guy Zizek brings some very intriguing notions, you should listen to him on youtube if you get a chance.

    I'm a familiar with some branches of buddhism, but not with this book, which is indeed one of the writings in hinduism. I have to check it out. The second book I have to read because of you, albeit a little different from the other one you mentioned ;)
  15. trapped7

    trapped7 "what you resist persists"

    Re: unleashing the real me

    The day went alright, I didn't encounter anymore addiction related problems.
    I noticed I feel the most aware and tend to think the most about the things I would like to change in my life, when I'm completely away of anything that's sexually triggering, M, edging, borderline material, everything.

    And to me that's precisely the point of the reboot - to stay of _everything_ P or M related. I guess profound changes can only happen then.

    I want to share a brief story, as I'm curious about your reactions.
    I remembered this really attractive and cute girl I met 3 years ago, and if I think about the situation now, it's clear to me she was into me, but I didn't see it back then nor did I take action. A friend of mine (who talked to her first) said to me back then how I should leave her alone, because he liked her. I said 'alright whatever you dork' (in a funny way) and didn't bother. But now that I'm out of the P fog I can see how much of an idiot I was. She didn't like him, she liked me! And I did nothing.

    So I thought, alright, why not text her now - 3(!) years later - just for the fun of it, to see what happens. I texted my friend to send me her phone #, he still had it saved and sent it to me. I then sent her an IM, writing that I met her 3 years ago and how we had fun and if she'd remember (adding something concrete that happened).
    I also added "if you don't want to write back because you think it's weird, that's also OK" (a friend of mine called me an idiot for adding this line)

    AND THIS IS WHAT HAPPENED: ........she didn't reply.

    Oh, by the way, no this was not the only woman I ever met. I've met other girls in the meantime and was also too stupid to ask them out. But something about that particular memory was upsetting to me, so I just had to send her this message now.

    Do you guy think I'm crazy and that this was a ridiculous endeavour? If you do... well I don't care! ;) But I want to know anyway what you think :)

  16. Gil79

    Gil79 Seize the day

    Re: unleashing the real me

    I think it's cool you just did that. It's the right mentality of life. Don't think things over too much, seize the day! I think the only reason she didn't respond is because she has a boyfriend now (or married with a kid or something). But yeah, I think it's better to leave out the 'don't respond if', just be bold.

    That situation with your friend is so familiar to me. I've missed out on such hot and great girls, because of the same mentality (ah, whatever). It's great that now you're taking life into your own hands again. Really cool you did that.
  17. trapped7

    trapped7 "what you resist persists"

    Re: unleashing the real me

    Day 97

    I was dreaming some weird stuff at night and at some point I dreamed that the girl responded my message. I was excited! Then I woke up in the middle of the night and realized it was a dream. I was disappointed.

    Then at 7AM I get an incoming message on my phone..... it's the girl!!
    She wrote she didn't remember but that wouldn't mean anything and if I could give her more info.

    I waited a few hours then I did and just now she wrote back that she even remembers me! (this was 3 years ago)
    I asked her if she wants to meet for coffee tomorrow, to which she replied, sure, she'd just need to check in her calender as she's in a meeting right now.

    How you like me now?
    I'll keep you posted! :)

    Gil and True, thanks for your replies.
  18. Gil79

    Gil79 Seize the day

    Re: unleashing the real me

    This post put a smile on my face, man :). Enjoy!
  19. trapped7

    trapped7 "what you resist persists"

    Re: unleashing the real me

    Day 99

    So, I met with the girl yesterday.

    And...... she was about 7-10 years older than I expected! LOL :p

    When I first met her 3 years ago, it was in some club and I thought she'd probably be around my age or a little younger. So I was expecting a girl around late 20s to early 30s.
    But she was definitely older than me, probably older than 35.

    But she was - as I remembered her - a totally laid-back and funny woman, with a similar kind of humor as myself. I like to say nonsensical or retarded stuff in a very serious way and she totally played along with this and even topped me sometimes with communicating nonsense with seriousness.
    But we also talked normally, it was a good talk and she said some very smart things. In the end she even shared chaos theory with me, which she knew about in detail!

    I'm not really interested, because of the age difference (yes guys I realize it's also possible to be with someone older than you) and because she wasn't exactly my type. But I might want to see her again, because she was fun to be around.
    The experience that a girl would write back after 3 years despite having met only briefly before was worth it by itself.

    It's a reminder that an action is worth more than 10,000 thoughts, as I've heard from a spiritual teacher before.

    Couldn't sleep at night again and had some weird sexual dream (I'd prefer a different kind, I don't get what's the matter with this) which turned into kind of a stressful dream / nightmare.
    In the morning I had fantasies going, which led to some edging.
    It's still unlikely for me to break the fantasies as they arise.
  20. Gil79

    Gil79 Seize the day

    Re: unleashing the real me

    I'm going to remember this one. Cool experience man, very positive.

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