Too Late to the Party?

Discussion in 'Ages 40+' started by Saville, May 15, 2016.

  1. Saville

    Saville Well-Known Member

    Fuck, I hope so! ha ha :D

    Felt so horny yesterday. When I was talking to a young colleague I was thinking "totally like to fuck you right now!" I'm old enough to be her dad and quite possibly granddad. o_O Then I was asking our secretary about something and I wanted to boiink the shit out of her and she ain't nothing to look at. She's in her 50's and probably still a virgin. She lives with her cats and talks incessantly about them. She has a hairy lip, unfortunate moles everywhere, and spits when she talks. So, sometimes you have a day when the lizard is roaming around and he isn't particular about what he eats, or drinks, or who he fucks. Yeah, so I was pretty much a komodo dragon yesterday. I don't often feel that horny anymore, so it kind of caught me unaware...must be an after-effect from the bj! :cool:

    So, speaking of wanting to copulate with those who are not your SO, I'd like to mention a couple of things. Over the almost three years I've been here, from time to time there are men who write that they think having a bit of variety will make their lives better. Some guys make a case for it, saying that their wives won't give them sex anymore, or the same old sex is boring, or that people are not meant to be monogamous. @Doofus was recently writing about this on someone else's journal, but he's mentioned it on his own before, as well. (Not singling you out or judging you, Doofus. It just sparked something that I wanted to write about) As a former serial cheater here are my thoughts on the matter.

    For men like us, making a case to have sex with anyone other than our SO's is rationalization. It is the addict trying to find another way to suck us back into the sewer. It's interesting that we believe, after a few months of being clean, following decades of stuffing P into our brains and choking our chickens mercilessly, that we're healthy enough to make big decisions about our sex lives. I've seen so many guys come here, get clean for a time, and then all of sudden they're read to ditch their wives or consider polyamory. I'm not judging anyone in the sense that I think they are bad, but I am judging their fitness to be able to see their lives clearly after only a short time of sobriety. I remember a great guy who posted here called jam. He was smart and determined to beat his addiction. I really loved his presence on the forum here, but I had a sense that he wanted to upend his marriage. (Jam, if you're reading, you can set the record straight if I'm way off base, which has been known to happen :oops:) Obviously if that's what someone wants then that's up to them, but when you are an addict, who is not yet fully healthy, then you are most likely doing it for the worst reason, because it's the addict who is dictating the change, not you.

    What I usually see here with men who are in relationships is that the relationships, over years, have become completely dysfunctional. Both parties are shut down in some way or another. Usually we've played the nice guy and our wives have taken on a roll where they're wearing the pants. This isn't the role they want, but it's what they've assumed, because of a lack of real male presence being around. We created a vacuum by being passive, by being nice, by not claiming our male status. It takes a fucking long time for this to untangle, but it definitely will once we've been off the P and M for a good long while. Over that time we must insist on our right to have sex, but we must also assume other male things in the house, such as taking care of shit like the broken piece of baseboard, the bit of painting we never did, etc. In my opinion, and I have at least seen this borne out in my own relationship, there is a cost to having access to your woman's pussy; that being that we must willingly shoulder more of the emotional load. When the woman bitches and moans it's our job to suck it up, so long as they are opening their legs regularly. The subtle levels of a relationship are there once the fundamental need is addressed.

    It is easy to lose sight of the fact that we are on our own journey. By chasing other pussy we are putting, once again, our creative life on hold. We are saying "my life doesn't matter," which is exactly where the addict wants you. It's also where our bullshit society wants us. The status-quo wants us to stay as unmotivated slaves. Our prisons are filled up with TV's, two week holidays, trips to the mall, etc. So long as we are staring at P, wishing for other bearded clams, and feeling resentful about how our woman has treated us, we are spinning on societies hamster wheel. A man needs to fuck and he needs to love, but he must also do something with his life that feels worthy.
  2. Saville

    Saville Well-Known Member

    I had a drink last night. We went out for dinner with some old friends who we hadn't seen in a long while. They both love to drink...and it shows. They arrived at the restaurant before us and had already ordered a bottle of wine. I decided I would indulge in a half a glass, which is what I did. The first sip was heavenly. I thought I might cream in my pants it tasted so good. Second sip was good, but by the third sip I was over it. We went back to their place afterward, but I declined his 18 year old scotch in favor of a herbal tea. Now that I'm not "fun" anymore I wonder how much we'll see them in the future? The half glass of wine showed me how little I enjoy it now. Oh, and even though it was only half a glass, I still got a headache from it, which lasted about half an hour. I told my wife last night that drinking is no longer going to be part of who I am.

    My horniness just seemed to be a one day thing. I was at the gym yesterday, babes all around who were scarcely clothed, and I felt nothing. I didn't do much cardio, but at least I went. I've never felt more committed to losing weight in my life. I've lost a ton of weight before, but I've never had the same mind-set. Previously I always lost weight with the thought that I would one day go back to eating shit. Now, I just don't want that shit in my life. I don't want ice cream, cake, chocolate, or chips. I'm not saying I won't partake of a little here and there, but I'm not going to shove it into the void. You know, that void in all of us that is endless and demands yet more and more consumption of unhealthy things.

    I got a book by Dr. Wayne Dyer out of the library; it's about intention. He describes intention like a flowing river. Intention isn't something we have to create in ourselves through discipline, but rather something we only need reach out to and grasp. You know what? I don't give a shit. Intention, blah blah blah, like a river, blah blah blah, we can all do it, more blah blah blah. I think Dyer was a great man, but I really don't have time, nor care, about self-help shit, anymore. I'm, like, totally over it, like, you know?:p I already know the way. Eat reasonably well, go to bed at a reasonable time, don't indulge in habits that drag you down, and own your own life. That's all there is.

    I listened to a podcast about this young woman who had cystic fibrosis. Like so many young people who have a terminal illness, her clarity of thought was amazing. Her life, from the time she was born, was getting sick, going to hospitals, having procedures, and trying to live each day as best she could. She said "I've looked for something that would make me well, make life better, but I just have to accept who I am." She wasn't fatalistic, I think. She saw that she had what she had, and better to just get on with things. At age 20 she had a double lung transplant to save her life; she lasted another year. I cried at the end of the podcast. It just didn't seem fair. I wanted her to live, to finish her degree, to marry. I cried for her and for all that unlived life.

    It's a great day to be alive! :)
  3. Bobo

    Bobo Well-Known Member

    I listened to the same podcast a while back. I to cried at end---- life however disturbed or painful is still precious. Made me think of all guys I saw die in Iraq. Life is good, very good.
    Saville likes this.
  4. Caoimhín

    Caoimhín Winter's coming...

    A few years ago, I went an entire year without a drink. The test was to see if I was an alcoholic. (Since I had no trouble with abstaining, I falsely concluded that I was ok). The big difficulty was socially because some of my friends would tease me or at least bring it up whenever we were out. That eventually stopped but I found it difficult to continually explain why I was not drinking. Now, I could have made things easier by saying that I was trying a health experiement but in my mind, where truth dwells, I was ashamed at the thought of having to explain: I am an alcoholic.

    I probably would have caved in when the bottle of fine scotch came out :confused:o_O

    Also, for several years I followed what I could loosely call a "paleo" diet. But within that community, people were constantly saying that it is not a "diet" but a lifestyle. It is not just about food but about healthy living: healthy movement and diet for us 21st century dudes. You cannot separate these things and deal with them alone. If you are eating perfectly but spending 14 hours a day on Facebook, something is wrong.

    These are all good reminders for me because as the winter is dragging on, my good habits are all less good! Great to see you putting it all together and figuring stuff out!
    Libertad and Saville like this.
  5. Saville

    Saville Well-Known Member

    So true!

    Not much to say or report. @Libertad posted a good rant by Gabe, the original poster boy. I liked it when he said regarding relapses "someone like you would relapse." Puts the responsibility to really change squarely on our shoulders. However, I also think we must extend some love. I've dished out lot of tough love on here, but sometimes a guy needs a pillow, somewhere safe to lay his head. We do need to sometimes kick our inner-bitch in the nards, but we also must be gentle on ourselves...there's a balance.

    Not all of our parts are defective. :) In fact, we are not defective, at all. Inside us we have a little devil who wants us to think we're broken, that we need a bit of a wank. We don't need a wank and we don't need booze. We are actually A-OK, just as we are. This is great news! We are just who we should be, we are authentic, and special. Today I'm just being me. I'm a guy who when you take away the PMO, the sexting, the cheating, the booze, the under-performance and the anger is pretty cool. :p:cool:

    The guy that's sitting down in his recliner, that's me, is already all he (I) need. It's actually an incredible thought to me now: I don't need fixing, not at all. As I am, right now, is just who I'm meant to be.

    If we can just be then there's actually no work involved. This feels like an epiphany, because I really feel it, down deep. The struggle is not real. The triumph is not real. We are already great as we are, we are already healed.
    Caoimhín and Bobo like this.
  6. Bobo

    Bobo Well-Known Member

    Yes, we are already healed. We just have to believe it. All that we are, should be, can be is completed. You are you standing tall and proud ---- everything is done---- you don't have to try or struggle.
    Saville likes this.
  7. Saville

    Saville Well-Known Member

    Thanks, Bobo! :)

    I just finished reading a book "A Street Cat Named Bob." It's about a drug addict who's finds a cat in his apartment building and it becomes his reason to get off methadone and lead a more productive life. It's rather repetitive, but the story is cool. The cat became his lifeline, his friend, his reason to carry on. The cat also allowed him to get out of his own head, because he felt responsible to take care of it. It's a sweet story of someone changing their life. One of the best parts was when he decided to get off of methadone and having to deal with the most horrendous withdrawal symptoms. Heroin addiction takes people down an awful path. Homelessness, thievery, selfishness, and self-destruction. P is a little different; it's the gentlemen's heroin. We are dragged onto virtual streets, where we consort with the underbelly of a dark city. We aren't homeless, or sticking needles in our arms, but are we any better than those who do?

    Yesterday I really wanted to eat candy. I also thought about getting a hold of some pot, although I don't know how I'd do that. I'm not going to, but it seems yesterday was a day where the mind wanted distraction. It's funny, because I just watched my mind twisting in the wind, knowing how the little demon was trying to take me down the old paths. Nope, not going down there anymore.

    Just before quitting drinking I bought 10 bottles of rather nice wine. There are still 8 in the wine rack. I haven't tasted a drop, not even when my wife offered me a glass of an excellent rioja. Normally, those bottles would all be gone and I would have made two more trips to the liquor store. I'm going to save thousands of dollars this year, which makes me smile. :)

    I hope you're all having a cool day! :cool:
    A New Man, Bobo and Caoimhín like this.
  8. Saville

    Saville Well-Known Member

    The wife and I went out another couple's place last night. The guy said "geez, I feel badly that I can't entice you to have a drink with me." I said "you can twist my arm to have a tea!" :) I enjoyed myself just as much as I usually do. His wife, who is lovely, talked too much. My wife talked too much. The guy drank a lot and laughed an equal amount and I did my usual too. It's funny, but, apparently I can be just as social, just as humorous, without imbibing. I'm going on holiday in a few days and we'll see if I have a drink or two. I'm not ruling it out, but not ruling it in, either.

    I think I feel good. I feel the same in many ways. Giving up drinking hasn't suddenly made everything amazing. I still feel groggy when I first wake up and I still fight that feeling of "meh" some days. But, I haven't even been off of it two months yet. I remember when I first gave up PMO, I felt so fucking drained, and it went on for months. The fatigue felt debilitating some days. So, I think some of what I'm going through is withdrawal. I abused alcohol for years and so it's natural that my body will take a good long while to get back to feeling its old self. I'm sure my liver is going through all kinds of detoxing. But, like with getting rid of PMO, I believe in the process. I believe my life will be infinitely better without it.

    I'm down about 11 or 12 lbs. I have one of those guts that just sticks out and it's fucking hard, probably due to gas. What I've noticed over the 6 + weeks is the top of the bulge, around the solar plexus, has diminished quite a bit. So, I'm taking that as a win. I've upped my cardio a bit and that can only help.

    @forlorn spoke on his journal about taking therapy to deal a bit with possible past issues. I was quick to dismiss it, because I have such a fervor for moving forward and making everything that counts an action. However, after @Caoimhín response I've changed my tune. One of the great things about this place is it really allows us to learn. I'm not always open to the opinions of others, even though I try to be. So, with that in mind, I've decided I'm going to delve a bit in to my own past, or rather, the responses from my past. It stands to reason that my body does certain things when I'm in certain situations - if it didn't, then I would feel better mentally than I do. I'm going to watch how my body reacts. I'm going to slow everything down and see what physical blocks my body puts in place when it faces a stimulus that feels, for lack of a better word, threatening. I remember seeing a book at my local library how our bodies hold onto past traumas and so I may check it out, as a way to better inform my study.

    I've noticed my memory the last couple of days if amazing. I have no idea what to put this down to if it is not my lack of drinking. I am also feeling a bit more creative. Oh, and this is weird: my voice seems deeper. A lot of guys here have reported a deeper voice when they've quit jacking off. I think that makes sense, because jacking off disrupts hormonal balances. But drinking? Well, my theory is that the drinking was causing reflux, something I already take a pill for. I wasn't feeling the reflux, but it was there, and it must have been literally burning my vocal cords. I think this is a cool and astonishing result. :)
    forlorn, Caoimhín and Libertad like this.
  9. Caoimhín

    Caoimhín Winter's coming...

    @Saville Glad that I was able to inspire you. You have definitely inspired and encouraged me regarding drinking. Although I knew lots about the negative effects on my life and body, I clung on to it. It took someone to model the behaviour for me, so for that, I say thank you!

    One thing to keep an eye out for, in terms of potential trauma, is when you notice particular physiological responses. For example, if you are trying to do something but your heart is beating madle, it could represent something traumatic. I am not an expert and have only been considering the effects of this within the last year.
    Saville likes this.
  10. Gilgamesh

    Gilgamesh Seize the day

    So familiar. All those different ways to not be in the moment, while actually you just need to rest and calm down. About the pot: Last summer, during a very good 'no-arousal' streak, I all of a sudden decided it was a good idea to order some seeds and grow my own pot. It had been more than 10 years I last smoked! I guess my mind was looking for a substitute for porn. I grew 3 plants in my garden and when they were getting bigger I thought 'what the hell am I doing! I am a father of a 3-year old' and I threw the plants on the compost heap. Then in Autumn, I passed by the compost heap and saw that a plant with the nicest buds had arisen from the heap. I couldn't let it be for wjhat it was. Waited some weeks and cut the sticky buds off to dry them. I smoked some in November this year and again a couple of weeks ago. It was a disappointment. I kept telling myself it would relax me and give me useful insights. It did relax me, but it was actually just a search for a dopamine high.. … and yeah, I combined it with watching porn :oops:. Still have to throw away the rest of it though . . .
    Saville likes this.
  11. Saville

    Saville Well-Known Member

    Thanks, @Caoimhín, I'll definitely keep a watch out for those things.

    I was watching a documentary on Netflix called "Heal." It was in my suggested list. In general, and on principle, suggested lists annoy me. I don't want a computer generated "something or other" suggesting anything, thank you! Anyway, I'm glad it was on the list, because I've gotten a lot from it. I realized that I am only scratching the surface here. Well, that's not true, I've known for awhile that I'm just hanging around the surface of what I am. But, there's nothing like a little inspiration to catalyze our attention. The documentary is about alternative healing. It's about how we hold onto emotional stuff, old hurts, abandonment issues, etc. So many people have these non-specific illnesses, like lupus, fibromyalgia, skin diseases, depression, anxiety, and so much more. They interviewed a number of alternative practitioners and they weren't the wackadoos you'd usually see. One was a MD, another a chemist, and so on. We are all energy and we have the power to shape this energy for good or ill. One guy, a scientist who was one of the original guys who cloned cells, said "there's the placebo effect, but there's also the no-cebo effect." Meaning that negativity can have the potential to bring us down. It's a great way to put it, isn't it? I felt lifted in spirit watching the documentary, because it showed me how much more there is out there for me to look at. There are great people out there with great energy and they aren't part of the usual status-quo of doctors and therapists.

    I'm quite sure it's for the dopamine. lol I smoke pot about once a year, sometimes once every two years, and I really enjoy the feeling. I haven't bought weed since I was 19, so my toking has only been on the rare occasion I am offered it. I suppose now I'm off the booze there's always that danger that I would start substituting cannabis, though. At the moment I'm definitely grooving on natural highs. After overloading the old dopamine centers for years I should be content to indulge in the small pleasures like walks and smiling at people. Since giving up P I actually do smile a lot more. It's funny who will smile back. Some people are very guarded when they pass a stranger, and I can see they're just barely holding onto their frown muscles. Others, when they pass you, are completely disarmed and will smile broadly back. :) I love that when it happens. I don't have the best smile, but so long as the smile is coming from a natural place it makes people respond positively. I used to think that my smile looked like one of a child snatcher, such is the unfortunate lot of my face, but I look more favorably on it now. ha ha :) Gosh, some people have these enormous, incredible, smiles that light up the day. In my next life I want one of those! :D
  12. NCBob

    NCBob The 11th commandment: Thou shalt not peek:-)

    I just read through a bunch of your posts, Saville, and every so often, wanted to comment about the cool/interesting/insightful thoughts you were sharing. WAAAAAAAAY too many for me to respond to, so I will need to keep it simple. Keep up your GREAT efforts, bro:D
    Saville likes this.
  13. Saville

    Saville Well-Known Member

    Thanks NCBob! :)

    I'm going off to see one of my kids in a couple of days. I'm looking forward to being a different dad. We get along well, but the first question out of my mouth won't be "should we go to the liquor store?" Over this past decade I've drunk copiously around my children - that guys gone. Even though they are adults, I'm still going to pattern better behavior for them. They will find their own struggles in this world, but they will also remember that their dad, at age 60, changed things in a significant way for the better. I'm doing it for me, but if there's wider benefit then that's awesome!

    Boinked the wife yesterday. It was fine. Got my rocks off, which is always good. At the moment I'm not as into sex as I was before. I think it's becoming less of a focus in my life. I'm hoping that's true, anyway, as these things can definitely ebb and flow. I have some kind of sinus something or other going on, so it could easily be that too.

    The struggle is real, but there are so many great options out there. :)
    Bobo likes this.
  14. Bobo

    Bobo Well-Known Member

    Seems you never depart from being dad---none of us do- being a dude (described by wifey ) or a growing person. I am sure your kid will see a different picture of you. Whether positive or negative that's up to him or her to decide.

    Sex sometimes seems great other times it's ok then sometimes its literally a pure pain. Mostly the first but definitely the others at various times.
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2019
    Saville likes this.
  15. Saville

    Saville Well-Known Member

    True. Our journey is for us and if there are happy by-products as a result of that then: cool! :)

    Which makes sense. Something so intimate, so animal, as sex, should be incredible all the time. It takes courage to say no when we don't want sex. The jungle beat should reach a fury until we want to consume ourselves in the other person.

    I've been listening to all kinds of different music. When I first left the PMO world I began listening to Beethoven string quartets; they literally still blow my mind. I listen to a lot of jazz now, too. There's depth there. It takes effort sometimes to get into it, but the rewards are fucking awesome.

    I've woken up the last three days and felt heavy in my head. But, I also feel happy. I'm not questioning why, brothers, I'm taking it for what it is. Yeah, I'm allowed to feel happy. :)
  16. Saville

    Saville Well-Known Member

    "The only thing in life achieved without effort is failure." St. Francis of Assisi

    I never heard it put quite like that before.

    "God could not have chosen anyone less qualified, more of a sinner, than me. And so, for this wonderful work He intends to perform through us - He selected me. God always chooses the weak, the absurd, and those who count for nothing." St. Francis of Assisi

    Why shouldn't we be the vanguard of something better? Why not?! Why shouldn't people who pull their pud everyday, who have watched lasciviousness with gusto, be the ones who are capable of great change? Well, who better!
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2019
  17. Bobo

    Bobo Well-Known Member

    St. Francis of Assisi---- truly a gifted soul. I have read so much of his sayings and written works and they never cease to amaze me and strengthen me and make me understand I can do it. I am only a man BUT as he says God loves you and you"you are the stuff angels are made of."
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2019
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  18. Bobo

    Bobo Well-Known Member

    Maybe I will post a saying of St.Francis of Assisi once a week w e will see.. He has so many that are simply astounding. What do you guys think ?
    Saville likes this.
  19. Saville

    Saville Well-Known Member

    I'd say go for it! :) There can never be too many affirmations.

    I had little sleep last night. In fact, my sleep has been kind of shit for a few weeks now. Without booze (as Doofus has found) sleep can be elusive. I think my body just needs to adjust. I've only been at it for 7 weeks, which is nothing, though it is a great start. Shit, I remember when I was patting myself on the back for going 4 days without booze.

    Anyway, I woke, feeling groggy, but I felt OK. If I sweep away the tiredness, and other worries in my life, I can see that life is good. So, feeling reasonably content can be the default, though shiznit may swirl around. Their was a French psychologist , Émile Coué, who developed a mantra that he said was beneficial to all: "Everyday in everyway, I'm getting better and better." I say this phrase sometimes out loud. I will say it up to 20 times, each time changing my inflection. I like to look out the window and gesture toward the wider world.

    So much can bring us down, can't it? The news is awful, all the time! Families burned to death, riots in far off countries, war, people losing's endless. We lose sight of the fact that the sun rises, each and every day...and did anyone see last night's moon? Wow! It was fucking huge. A giant white orb sitting just above the horizon at one point. I've stopped reading the news. I can't tell you how much better I feel. I am familiar enough with the concept of misery and I really don't need to hear more about it. Society tells us that we're sticking our heads in the sands if we don't know what's going on, but that is what the status-quo would say. It wants us to feel miserable with all the misery. No wonder we run to P or alcohol. Wife's being a bitch, work is stressful, kids are behaving like animals, and the world is falling apart. Woe is me! ha ha But, if I wake up, and say "everyday in everyway, I'm getting better and better," and I mean it, then great and amazing things transpire. I begin to operate on a different plane, a higher one, I think.

    I've only got one life. Am I going to use it for enlightenment or misery?
  20. Gilgamesh

    Gilgamesh Seize the day

    There's definitely a wider benefit. Not only with your relatives. It is inspiring to everyone you interact with.
    Saville likes this.

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