Tired of the bouncing ball

Discussion in 'Ages 40+' started by Get ‘er Done, Sep 7, 2019.

  1. Get ‘er Done

    Get ‘er Done New Member

    This started around 13. Had a 2 year victory around 2000 or 2001. Keeps nipping at my heels. Need to step on this ball once and for all! So here I go.
     
  2. Fish Hawk

    Fish Hawk Well-Known Member

    Welcome aboard! Lots of men with good ideas here. Read as much as you can of other people's journals again welcome aboard.
     
  3. Get ‘er Done

    Get ‘er Done New Member

    Thanks Bobo!!
     
  4. Joshua Shea

    Joshua Shea Active Member

    How's it going?
     
  5. Get ‘er Done

    Get ‘er Done New Member

    Relapsed yesterday:( Porn. No masturbation. Still not sure if masturbation in and of itself..apart from porn.. is bad.
     
    Last edited: Sep 19, 2019
  6. nuclpow

    nuclpow Active Member

    Around here it's mostly believed masturbation, while trying to quit porn, is a bad idea and doesn't help. Once you're no longer addicted, apparently it's fine.
     
  7. MissingSelfCompassion

    MissingSelfCompassion Active Member

    For me, it's all connected. "Hey, that's an attractive person over there. Wow." Two hours later, that thought drives me to porn or masturbation. So, even if I masturbate without porn, the next hour, or day, I'm convincing myself it is okay to do again...and again. I believe scientifically it is literally connected in neural pathways in our brain. You burn your hand on a stove, you make a neural pathway that connects burn to hot to stove to pain. So, stove, hot, and burn all lead to pain. And, porn, masturbation, fantasy all lead to escape from pain for me.

    As suggested, poke around the forum and read what people have written. I had a hard time at first, I was able to post, but not read what others wrote. I think it made it too real for me. I wanted to punish myself and believe it was just me with the problem. Or, would reading others let me off the hook? However, once I started reading others I started to understand myself better. Have a look at the journal of @A New Man

    Welcome.
     
  8. Get ‘er Done

    Get ‘er Done New Member

    Thanks guys for sharing. Sadly I had another relapse this time porn and masturbation. Going to poke around on others posts and battles like MSC said.
     
    MissingSelfCompassion likes this.
  9. Get ‘er Done

    Get ‘er Done New Member

    LOL Wild Bill. I am married and struggle with this. Always scared of getting caught by the wife again. If I was single I hate to see where I would be at. You a strong man!
     
    MissingSelfCompassion likes this.
  10. MissingSelfCompassion

    MissingSelfCompassion Active Member

    Yes! Then again... I started to wonder if the cloak and dagger was part of it. That secret stop for french fries on the way home makes them taste so much better when no one knows, right? Like if my spouse says she's going to go to the store, my brain starts doing the math, do I have enough time? I think for me it's all related-- sneaking became part of masturbation early on as a child, so now it's part of those neural pathways associated with it.
     
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  11. Joshua Shea

    Joshua Shea Active Member

    @Get ‘er Done While I didn't learn this concept until I was well into recovery, I've been told that this works for guys in your position, who aren't 100% sure whether they're addicted to porn, masturbation or both. For the next 10 days, give yourself permission to look at porn, but you may not masturbate to it. Conversely, you are completely allowed to masturbate, but without visual aids. I've heard of people doing this and recognizing that it was the porn, not the masturbation, they were addicted to, or vice versa. It's kind of a chicken-or-egg thing. Do you use porn so you can masturbate or do you masturbate as a reason to look at porn? I'd think that when you can isolate what the main issue is, it would be more helpful to focus on that.
     
    MissingSelfCompassion likes this.
  12. forlorn

    forlorn Well-Known Member

    This is an interesting idea/approach. I've never considered isolating porn and masturbation with a view to establishing which is causing more of a problem. But having given it some thought, from a personal perspective I'd guess that porn is the bigger of the two issues because it's artificial. No good can come from looking at it. The two are definitely entwined in my behavioural patterns as I am certain that I would be physically unable to masturbate without either looking at porn or recalling a previous porn-based fantasy. Thus I think masturbation is the lesser issue, however early in recovery at least, it's best to avoid both.
     
    Joshua Shea likes this.
  13. Joshua Shea

    Joshua Shea Active Member

    @forlorn I do think it's best to avoid both in early recovery, and I didn't need this experiment to understand that it was porn for me, but I don't think it had anything to do with being artificial. I think it just allowed me to get lost in a world of fantasy much longer than non-visually stimulated masturbation. If it wasn't for the clear "finish line" of masturbation, I would have looked at a lot more porn. I believe the same was true with my alcoholism...the buzz or drunken state lasts quite a while and during it, there's a numbness to the real world. With that, the finish line was either falling asleep or getting physically ill. Perhaps this is the wrong place to say it, but while I've been porn free since late March of 2014, I've probably masturbated 8-10 times since then, sans porn, and I have not once felt guilty, nor jonesing for more, confirming it really was the porn that I was addicted to.
     
  14. MissingSelfCompassion

    MissingSelfCompassion Active Member

    I tried to confide in my spouse but my personal shame demon is still very much in control. It felt like I was letting her down when I PMO'ed and had to tell her. I realize that I was projecting my own disappointment on her, this is shame, feeling I AM BAD. Brene Brown and researchers say that secrecy, silence, and judgement are the ingredients for shame. At the same time, Brown says you don't have to tell the world, you have to find someone that will be empathetic. The amazing people on this board advised me to not worry about talking to my spouse about it. I felt uncomfortable, as if I was lying. However, after hearing what Brown said, I realize that is why I am here. I can share my struggles with all of you because you understand. My partner cannot understand. She has her own body issues and insecurities that make my addiction about her. So, I'm back here trying to share with all of you. Thanks for the opportunity. I wish you luck in whatever you decide is best for you @Get ‘er Done
     
  15. Get ‘er Done

    Get ‘er Done New Member

    Yes for sure. I have always been sneaky from youth. Actually like you said enjoy it. Follows me into everything.
     
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  16. Get ‘er Done

    Get ‘er Done New Member

    Sounds a bit like my story. Got caught by my wife about 20 years ago. The curtain was pulled back and boy was I exposed. Was glad it was out in the open but very ashamed. Told my wife all my falls at first. She got tired of it. Got together with a support group at my Church. When she would catch me again it was awful. Told her if she would ask me how I was doing at the end of each week it would be a great determent . She would have nothing to do with it. Left me confused. Of course if she asks me directly about it I will tell her.
     
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2019
  17. Get ‘er Done

    Get ‘er Done New Member

    This is me also
     
  18. Get ‘er Done

    Get ‘er Done New Member

    Relapsed again. This is annoying.
     
  19. nuclpow

    nuclpow Active Member

    Do you have filtering on your devices? At least for your most common go-to sites?

    It makes a load of difference for me, and it looks like almost anyone making any progress here has filtering.
     
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  20. Joshua Shea

    Joshua Shea Active Member

    @nuclpow I never used filtering because I told myself from the start that I'm tech savvy enough to get around it, or simply find another means, rendering it pointless. I'm always interested in learning from people who it worked for. Do you know how to disable the filters? Does simply knowing they are there and you'd have to spend time getting around them stop you? How do they serve as an effective block? Are there times that they don't stop you?
     
  21. Get ‘er Done

    Get ‘er Done New Member

    I know a couple men who have filters and blocks on their pc and mobile devices set up by their wives. So if they misbehave on those devices or try to disable it the wives get a message or email. But as the one friend told me there is one of his devices that the set up don't cover it's browser but has amazingly he has left it alone. So yes if your SO will get a notice and you care that they do then yes they work well.
     
  22. Get ‘er Done

    Get ‘er Done New Member

    No I don't. Even if i did I have been working on computers for years and would find away around. And yes I would spend the time to do it. It would be part of the thrill. Wild Bill is right.
     
  23. nuclpow

    nuclpow Active Member

    I feel like sharing because I was in a similar position, and I don't want you to shoot yourself in the leg.

    Without blocking I have the intuition to look at porn it seems every 5-20 seconds. I can disable all the filtering I have in a few minutes. It's just the psychological barrier of it. Somehow it works. While disabling the filter, I ask myself, "Do you want to relapse to porn several times a week, from now until forever? Is unrestricted porn use and all the downsides that come with it really what you want to do with your life?".

    I wish I had blocking that I couldn't get around, but right now this "voluntary" filtering is working enough that I can have a life and look for other ways to quit porn. It seems like it wouldn't, but filtering works for me even though I can disable it easily. It seems to remove 98-99% and it relaxes me because I don't have to use willpower.

    It didn't help much at first, but somewhere I seem to have crossed a hump and now I would almost swear by filtering. But, you do what works for you! :)
     
  24. Get ‘er Done

    Get ‘er Done New Member

    Thanks. I see your point muclpow. What filtering program do you use?
     
  25. nuclpow

    nuclpow Active Member

    I use hosts file filtering (or this site) and Simple Blocker. Basically, you find your hosts file, and then whenever you want to add a site to it you add a line like:
    127.0.0.1 www.example.com example.com
    And then your web browser won't be able to get to it anymore.

    Like I said, they would take me minutes to disable, but just having them on there blocks out about 96% of my porn impulses and reduces porn use by about 99%. It's a psychological barrier. I can't explain it, but it works for me.

    I hope you just take this as a suggestion. But if you're stressing yourself not looking at porn, or white-knuckling it, it's possible some basic filtering might help with your life. I haven't read your whole journal yet to be sure though.

    I hope that helps.
     
    MissingSelfCompassion likes this.
  26. MissingSelfCompassion

    MissingSelfCompassion Active Member

    I just looked at my most recent programs on the desktop and saw the application I used to edit my hosts file. It was in the recents because I was opening it to edit it quickly and PMO. I haven't used for almost 2 weeks now. Sure, part of it is my willpower. Another thing that has helped is that I haven't used this desktop much. I think that there are neural pathways that associate it with porn. During my sobriety last week, I'd find myself sitting down to do a quick check of email and my hand would be in my pants even though there was no porn. :confused: I maintained my streak, but that was an interesting thing to notice. Like muscle memory or something. Anyway, I was disappointed to see the application in my recents list. For a fraction of a second it felt like a trigger. I saw it, thought about how I use it, and then felt intense shame and wanted to punish myself. That last bit is another one of my triggers, I'm a failure so I might as well fail.

    So yes to filtering, but in the end it is all up to ourselves. This isn't an easy journey @Get ‘er Done and you're doing great so far! Believe it and believe in yourself.
     

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