Reason vs. AntiFap Brigade (Warning: long OP, so don't tl;dr me)

Discussion in 'Pornography Addiction' started by Hellborg, Aug 24, 2013.

  1. Yea, I relapsed several times, and so did most of us. So what?
     
  2. WhirlwindTobias

    WhirlwindTobias Man Against Mediocrity

    Whoa man, don't mistake my post for an attack. I actually misread your post; I thought your current streak was what you stated, thought your counter was inaccurate and was merely pointing it out. Don't jump on my back too!

    My bad.
     
  3. lalisor

    lalisor New Member

    And I've gone 84 without, say again? maybe i should go for 90+ this time, this thread kinda got me motivated (and Tobias video)

    I asked a question, and you call me weak, why? you don't know me, so please don't say what i cannot do.
     
  4. WhirlwindTobias

    WhirlwindTobias Man Against Mediocrity

    Sweet, glad I could help!
     
  5. Sorry, I thought you asked it to justify MO'ing.

    Still, I think the goal is to eliminate the limitations of our willpower.
     
  6. lalisor

    lalisor New Member

    not productive no, but his answer was totally uncalled for.

    i admire your streak, you have some serious willpower. I think i will try again with complete abstinence, masturbation ain't THAT great, but I like the sleepy effect...
     
  7. lalisor

    lalisor New Member

    yes, i guess it could sound like that.

    sure, we can try to eliminate our limitations, but is it physically possible?

    maybe Tobias got super willpower genes, and what hes doing is not possible for everyone else (again, not trying to justify MO).

    ego depletion, thats the word im looking for
     
  8. WhirlwindTobias

    WhirlwindTobias Man Against Mediocrity

    At this point it's less about willpower, and more about being unable to comprehend masturbating...well at least in a solo context.

    My recent experiences have taught me I have no stigmatic thoughts while stimulating myself when I'm with a partner, but as you can imagine I much prefer their hands. I have yet to ejaculate of my own accord during my streak; fortunately as I have rebooted successfully and lost the conditioning of my own hands I have never had to resort to using them to finish off the job. Unlike having to do so all those other times pre-Nofap.

    maybe Tobias got super willpower genes, and what hes doing is not possible for everyone else (again, not trying to justify MO).

    Oh it's possible, I'm just a stubborn f*** :D

    Also:

    Your limitations are mostly defined by yourself. Remove the limitations you impose of your own accord, and you can achieve much more than you may have comprehended prior.
     
  9. I like to think that it is. Anyway, if your body thinks otherwise, it'll let you know.
     
  10. lalisor

    lalisor New Member

    whats your take on ego depletion? Is it bullshit or are you just particular strong?
     
  11. WhirlwindTobias

    WhirlwindTobias Man Against Mediocrity

    Honestly, this is the first time I've heard of the concept. Based on that alone, I can't give a critical opinion on it.

    I checked out the wiki page just now, but I obviously have to do more than that.
     
  12. hogus

    hogus Well-Known Member

    What proof?

    I've already said why the one you quoted to me proves nothing.
     
  13. Hellborg

    Hellborg New Member

    That's convenient. I will dig up more later for you.
     
  14. WoLong

    WoLong Guest

    Can someone explain to me the meaning of Alpha/Beta male in this context? In a tribal or pack setting, 'alpha' denotes the male that has come to be respected as leader, usually by physical dominance over the other males of the pack. However, human males generally mature out of this kind of social hierarchy after high-school. (In fact, studies show that verbally/physically aggressive males have less friends, even in high-school.)
     
  15. TheUnderdog

    TheUnderdog Active Member Staff Member

    I don't think it matters, really.
     
  16. WoLong

    WoLong Guest

    The sexual drives and preferences of many porn addicts have been heavily centered around the images seen in pornography, especially if much of their early introduction to post-pubescent sexuality was through porn. If your sexuality has not been greatly influenced by your porn usage, then perhaps masturbation will not have an averse affect on your porn recovery.
     
  17. TheUnderdog

    TheUnderdog Active Member Staff Member

    It is universally agreed that in order to beat pornography addiction we must, at the very least, significantly reduce the number of times we masturbate.

    Then comes the question "What to do after reboot?" or "What to do when you have already beat porn addiction?". This question is flawed because it assumes that you're going to be cured after XX days. If only it were that easy. We're talking about 10, 15 or even 20 years of sexual conditioning here.

    But even if the question is legit, people will start wondering "Well... if I went XX days without masturbation... then I can certainly continue like this, why masturbate at all? Is it really necessary?", and there's absolutely nothing wrong with that line of thought.

    You asked me how do I know that porn and masturbation are tightly linked together. Well, I've read enough posts from guys to know that it is true. I've been in this community long enough. Most porn addicts nowadays do not masturbate if it's not with porn. Maybe you are the exception to the rule, but it doesn't take away the fact that since tube sites and smartphones became popular, men have conditioned themselves to use these tools as an aid to masturbation.

    There is no such thing as "I will be cured after XX days". If your definition of being cured is getting rid of ED, then yes, but you will soon realize that this goes much more deeper than that. ED is just the tip of the iceberg.

    The only guys who get fully cured are those who adopt a lifelong change in philosophy when it comes to sex and masturbation. Guys like GABE and WhirlwindTobias. The latter for example finds value in depriving himself from instant gratification.

    A balanced state of mind is not just about dopamine receptors or sensitivity. It must be accompanied by a healthy view on sex.

    Abstaining from porn won't do shit if you're still thinking in terms of "I want to get rid of my ED so I can go and fuck all the women I want" or "I want to get to day XX so I can then masturbate whenever I want". But that is something I only learned until I finally got a girlfriend.

    A porn addict who is abstaining from hardcore porn but is still checking out girls on Facebook, sex chatting on webcams, fantasizing about sex constantly, and masturbating on a regular basis, is doing it wrong. He's doing absolutely nothing to deal with his addiction to novelty, lust, and fucking.

    That's why most people fail. They do nothing other than trying to abstain from watching porn. Their mentality regarding sex remains the same. It remains "pornofied".

    When people realize this then that's when they decide to quit masturbation and instant gratification forever. They are trying to make a deep change in their lives.

    That's what me and many others are trying to do right now.

    It's not about being a monk. It's not about being anti sex or anti masturbation. It's about achieving happiness by not centering your whole life on "fucking hot chicks". This issue must be handled, otherwise you will never have a satisfying and healthy relationship with a woman, because no single woman can ever satisfy a porn addict's obsession with novelty and fucking multiple girls.

    I hope this clears some doubts.
     
  18. pimpski

    pimpski New Member

    Thanks Underdog,
    I think, you summed up the solution to several threads in one stroke .
    .

    For me this is a paradigm shift. I understand it intellectually, but i feel unsecure, because i dont really know how to go about it.

    i wanna open a new thread about that.
     
  19. Joo

    Joo Guest

    Well hey, thats quite a paradigm shift, Pimpski! From planning to fuck loads of different chicks going to considering there might other ways to achieve happiness in life. ;)
    Sounds like you had an intellectual illumination moment. That's great.
     
  20. peacefulwarrior87

    peacefulwarrior87 New Member

    I really respect what you said there mate. I believe anyway that there's an age when "fucking hot chicks" is everything or almost that should really matter, it's a part of our life when we begin to discover our sexuality and as long as it's real life it's totally right. Love and attachment to a single woman is something we experience maybe when we are older and we believe there's more that just "fucking". infact it's called making love.

    and that's when this board kicks in. The true problem is that today people experiment their fantasies not on real life with real girls but behind a computer screen. They're not using facebook to hook up girls for meeting them in real life, they are just fapping on their photos. Pornography replaces real sex and real women are not exciting anymore, infact it replaces the "go for it" instinct. Why should I go hunting when I have my dinner already served through internet?

    Going back to the original subject of this thread. I started to think about my addiction when I realized I had to look at porn and MO everyday. It's something I've always been aware but I never considered this a real addiction just an habit. When it started to change my lifestyle, that's when I realized it was an addiction. Being awake till late night watching porn or PMOing when I was sad or depressed that was not just an habit, it was an addiction. Everytime I felt rejected by women I used to comfort myself in pornography and MO.

    MO and pornography are not bad things as long as WE don't use them in the wrong way. WE are - WE MUST be in control of our passions and desires.

    if we use PMO to make us happy or entertained because we are sad or bored. That's gonna become a DRUG, which is going to change our sex life and ultimately our life in a really bad way.

    Like someone who isn't happy with his life and begins to play MMORPG 24/7 consoling himself in a virtual world, instead of manning up and facing his fears and problems.

    I say the debate wheter you should or shouldn't masturbate it's totally pointless. What if I stop PMOing and even thinking of sex but start watching TV or even reading magazines without doing anything else positive in my life and for my life? Someone could say that even real sex or eating meat is an addiction. We are here not because we fear pornography masturbation or even sex. We are here because we want to make our lives better. The point is having the willpower to realize what can change YOUR life in a better way and quitting what ultimately makes YOU unhappy and keeps your life to be better. Find your answers.


    “everyone tells you what's good for you. they don't want you to find your own answers. they want you to believe theirs.”
     

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