Discussion in 'Ages 40+' started by Mozenjo, May 22, 2014.
Just a thought - have you thought of ditching the ED meds for a month or so?
Wow, this is just what I needed right now, path-forward. Getting stressed out every time we are planning on sex has really taken a toll on our relationship. I'm really happy you and your wife found some relief after taking the pressure off. That's exactly what I need to do. I'll talk more about it in my reply so Saville's post below, since it relates to what he mentioned...
Well, Saville, as a matter of fact, I considered ditching them entirely, but since path-forward has had some success with Cialis (tadalafil), which is more of a daily regimen (but in smaller doses), I ordered some of that. It should arrive today.
I actually do just want to go drug-free eventually, and maybe I should have tried that first, but I figured I'd give this a try. The theory is that, if I don't have to worry about when I take it, and am always ready to go, it may calm my nerves and be a good bridge to the other side (totally clean). Of course, I don't have to take them. I'll give it a try and see what happens.
Started the new meds. They work. Until they don't. I've realized that unless I surgically implant a steel rod in my pecker, no amount of drugs is going to keep it up if my brain is not in the right place.
What's telling, I think, is that last night we planned on having sex, went to a restaurant, came home, and I didn't feel like even going there. For several hours before I saw her, it just wasn't feeling like it was going to work.
However, after our now common conversation about how we can't go on like this, as I was laying in bed watching her walk around in her skimpy top, and knowing that sex was off the table, he magically came alive. So, rocket scientist that I am , I came to the conclusion that, yes, I have indeed psyched myself out to the point where it will only work again when I stop doing that shit.
I've been watching subs on a fairly regular basis lately, and have allowed some P back in too. Those will both conspire to keep me in this prison. So, calling myself out to stop that shit too. Now.
Moz. I went through exactly what you are experiencing about 15 years ago - before PMO was even the issue. The best way IMHO is to try sex with an understanding PIV is off the table. Try that a few times. And ofc if its obvious "the rule should be broken" go for it. But it will take all the pressure off the table. Just spend time experimenting in other ways. You need to reinforce that your dick is fine.
In regard to the P subs and P - obviously fight it as hard as possible. But most importantly - really push your to stop ANY PMO or MO.
you got this my friend!
This is painful, bro'. I think the demands your fiance is placing on you are unreasonable. I might be completely off-mark here (wouldn't be the first time) but I don't see there being any way forward for you, so long as your woman feels you have to be "fixed." This switch in meds is a hail mary. It's not just the peeking, it's also that you feel defeated, and this is why you are grasping at drug-straws. You are the little boy hoping you don't get scolded for not being able to do his duty.
What your fiance wants doesn't matter. My prescription, which is a harsh one, is this. Tell your SO that you don't want your day to revolve around whether your penis is going to work and that she is free to find someone else. Yes, I would basically say that for your own mental health you feel it would be better to end the relationship than to continue in this defeating charade. This will do two things. One, it will put you back in the driver's seat. Two, there is nothing like real drama to fire up those cylinders that are right now being squelched by being in fight or flight mode.
I had to have a similar conversation with my wife after getting caught cheating. I just couldn't take her always bringing up my infidelities. I especially couldn't take the undercurrent that I was slime. I told her she could either divorce me or stop talking about it: her choice. She stopped talking about it.
I would also take a break from all meds. Let your body reset itself and then introduce them again, if need be.
Again, always the caviet that this is just my opinion. The reality of your relationship may be vastly different from what I'm reading on these pages. No matter, I'm pulling for you!
All good advice, Saville. She apologized yesterday for the night before, saying as she often does that she doesn't know what to do to help me. And that she doesn't know why I feel pressured when I didn't seem to in the past.
It is frustrating that she doesn't seem open to trying something different. But we have to try something different. Ugh.
I'll think about the meds issue. Just took my daily dose a bit ago, and there is some feeling of "security" in not worrying about when and how much to take, like there was with the little blue pill. Bottom line is the meds did help before my current problem, since we would always have sex after a meal and alcohol. Those two things aren't always good for keeping it up, especially the alcohol.
I'm hanging in there, and told her I will get out of this slump. If she doesn't want to wait, that's her choice.
Thanks, path-forward. Yes, as I said in my reply to Saville above, we have to change up the routine. I agree with you that I need to "reinforce that (my) dick is fine". It IS fine. Works like a champ when I'm not feeling pressured to perform. Part of the problem now is that she also feels the pressure, so we're both stressed out over having sex. I'm confident that this will pass, but we both need to chill out.
Moz - Going to share something very personal that hopefully we give you some constructive
So my wife initiated sex VERY early this morning when we both realized the other was awake around 5 am. wayyy early for both of us! I was tired and had also peeked lately much more than I would like to admit rn. So both my fatigue and peeking was "chewing" a bit at my self-confidence. And this is despite being very successful in bed lately. My wife also is recovering from Bacterial Vaginitis which was caused by a lot of sex lately! (Sorry if TMI) She is on meds for it. So I also needed to be extra careful with hygiene. She asked that I wash my dick before sex and not use any saliva or artificial lube. She said she was wet enough on her own.
But not being to handle my dick a lot before penetration also threw off my ability to get reassurance of a hard dick.
And with all that in my head - I still got hard enough to start in missionary and then change positions to doggy.
Sooo - I should have felt on top of the world!
But my mind still had doubts despite all this! Hard to fight old fears sometimes. As your mind plays tricks on you.
So I asked my wife if I was fully hard, as we were having sex…
She said literally the instant I asked that question - my dick started getting soft. And that prior to the question - everything was perfectly fine with me.
So the point of my story is - it is 100% natural to over think things in bed - especially for guys like us - who have the equivalent of Dick PTSD from chronic PIED - despite actually being in recovery.
I am extremely blessed, that my wife has a better handle on my performance anxiety than I do! lol
And never makes me feel pressured. In fact - after I pulled out - she said: "thank you - I just needed to use you a bit and that was perfect!"
My guy friends all say she totally gets men.
And I dont mean to simply brag about her - and it can be a slippery slope comparing her to your fiancee. But you may want to grab parts of my story and explain to your fiancee the need to chill out and not give you a report card every time you have sex.
In regard to using daily meds, I respectfully disagree with the extremely wise and experienced Mr. Saville. I think we all need every security blanket we can have - when it comes to performance issues.
Bottom line - change the approach. And make sure your fiancee confirms she is supportive of new approaches. Just have fun with it. Take away the rules.
One fairly aggressive approach my wife uses to make me feel in control and its my choice about sex:
I am "allowed to rape her" as long as I don't truly hurt her. She is giving me the "baton" to decide when we have sex. While ofc I do not choose times when she is exhausted or not feeling well - that stills leaves a lot of opportunity to try things in different ways and different approaches.
Moz. Very sorry if this is overly personal and too unique to my own situation - just trying to give you some new ideas and perspectives.
I know you will get through this and be in a great place. Hang in there man!
@path-forward your advice is solid. You've been where Moz is and what you have to say is invaluable. However, I just want to clarify that I'm not against drugs to help things along. I'm basically for whatever works and makes a man happy. If that's carrot juice ten times a day and standing on one's head for 30 minutes, then I'm all for it. Having said that, no drug is benign. For example, I take drugs for reflux. Shutting down the acid production in my stomach allows me to live a better life, in a way, but it also has compromised the flora and fauna of my gut. From time to time I taper off the drugs to give my body a complete break and to also see if I can control the reflux with just diet. So far I have not been successful, but I'm not giving up. After a lifetime of being fat and eating poorly I have compromised my system in a major way. With porn we haven't so much compromised our physical bodies as our mental health. The brain, as I'm sure we all would agree, is the biggest sex organ we have.
Where am I going with this? I think that getting in touch with our natural system can be a good thing. If we are always taking a hand to get up then our muscles atrophy. The brain, the nerves, the muscles get out of the habit of doing their job. When body builders take steroids their natural testosterone diminishes. It not only diminishes, but because the body is in such a delicate balance, it actually increases estrogen; which leads body builders to take other drugs to counteract that.
As we age our bodies diminish. Our eyesight gets worse, our hearing fades, we lose collagen, our testosterone falls, etc. To keep some semblance of quality in our lives we need some supports, like glasses, hearing aids, walking sticks, and ED meds...it's all good! But, each thing we use means that we use less of our natural endowments. Mostly theses are good compromises. I guess what I'm saying is everything is by degrees. When we're young we might muscle a hundred pound box into the house by ourselves. As we age, it's probably a better idea to have someone help us so we don't throw our backs out. Finally, the last step would be to have someone else do the heavy lifting. Where we are at in our physical bodies is for each man to decide. We must be prudent, but also brave. We must recognize certain limits, but also trust ourselves. We mustn't be blind, but we also need faith. The End.
Well, my friends, some very timely comments from you! Will respond to both of you below:
Yes, this! Sometimes it takes a millisecond for it to go from battering ram to soft machine. I really wish that wasn't the case, but if this is the hand we were dealt... Pretty much every time I make love to the fiancee, there is at least one thing she says, or one look she gives me, that can be a mood killer if I let it. So I've decided that I need to plow ahead and let her negativity bounce off me if at all possible.
So... last night, a Tuesday of all days, I was horny (yes, the meds got the old guy to attention quite effectively yesterday), and after dinner and a little alcohol, I jumped her bones. I just started making out with her and groping her. She was surprised, in a good way, and got aroused alright, but she was tired and not quite ready to go the distance. So we spooned for awhile while she went on with "where did this come from?" and "who are you?". Talk about paralysis by analysis! I told her that weekends haven't been good for us lately, and that I wanted to act on my instincts, etc... Anyway, we both felt great afterward, even though we didn't have sex. What's the takeaway from that? Keep doing it! And don't worry about it!
Yeah, I think she needs to understand that disappointments will happen in the bedroom sometimes, but that ruminating about it will not make it better. Hopefully she got some of that message last night.
That's fantastic, path-forward. You are a lucky man! I know part of my gal wants to experiment as well. So, no time like the present
As for the meds:
This is very true, Saville, and has been weighing on me as I adjust to the new med. Yesterday I took 5mg in the morning (my online "pharmacist" recommended 5mg every other day). I'm not even a week into this new regimen, but I may try 5mg one day and 2.5mg the next, instead of 5mg every day. The reason I say this is that yesterday I had the same uncomfortable fullness in my noggin that the little blue pill produces. No doubt because they both get your blood flowing everywhere, not just to your groin. But, last night was pretty damned fantastic, so here I am in a place where I don't want to mess up a good thing (sex!) while at the same time not wanting to mess up another good thing (my body and brain!). Moderation, I guess. Maybe I'll settle on 2.5mg a day after I get some much needed boinking behind me. And then, ultimately, if I don't need it at all, so much the better We'll see.
Very wise words, my friend.
Saville had some more wisdom to impart this morning about the meds. I do eventually want to get off them. But the last few days have seen some vigor down there that is encouraging. This daily med isn't perfect (side effects, ugh), but it does the job. I just need it to do the job when the chips are down. I haven't peeked in 24 hours. I know, big whoop . So, to get to the point where I won't feel like I need to rely on the pills, I need to do some work and be squeaky clean like I know I can. That will be rewarded, I'm sure.
Had a bad weekend, PMO wise. Saturday night was a very nice date night, but we both got too tipsy, and after a whole day of anticipation, thinking it was finally going to happen, it didn't. I know what at least some of that is attributed to. Even though yesterday was 3 weeks since I last O'd, I've been peeking a lot and yanking on it a lot. Most of the yanking happens when I'm looking at the fiancee's pictures, but that still wires my neurons to pixels and not the real thing. It's just an excuse to play with the pud. I think the new meds are working better than the old ones, for sure, but the downside was that all day Saturday I was "testing" things to see how effective they were. I would think about her, and in a very short time be hard as a rock. It was encouraging, sure, but I couldn't help myself from grabbing it. So, as I've known all along, my way out of this mess MUST include stopping all of the above. I'm already fighting the chaser, but I'm going to eat a quick breakfast and try to miss the rush hour traffic. A busy day at work ahead. My challenge has always been consistency. To be consistent at "no arousal", or monk mode, is difficult. But I really need to leave it all alone and let myself recover. That's what it's always been about. I will only be able to perform again when I do what this forum is titled after: rebalance my brain.
I don't get it. Your said your fiancee wanted sex more but the last two times you were ready she's put you off.
Sorry, I should have been clearer. She didn't put me off Saturday, but after some dancing, the pud wasn't ready, and I think because of our inebriated states, neither of us was up for going any further. It wasn't the outcome we would have preferred, of course, but at least we didn't have a protracted conversation about it. We pretty much just spooned for a bit and passed out.
Ah, the vagaries of romance
Have you thought of changing your diet and ditching the booze? I absolutely love the taste of many types of alcohol. I have a pretty fine scotch collection. However, I do find it makes my body less awake. Initially it stimulates me, but that soon fades. As part of my diet plan a couple of years ago I gave up drinking for almost a year. I had had the habit of drinking wine every night and, on weekends, or when I felt like it, a couple of scotches. I felt so much more alive without booze and it was a lot easier on my pocket book too. lol At the same time I gave up coffee, dairy, eggs, wheat, nuts and a few other things. I would never have believed I could live without those things, but I was quite happy eating my new diet. The purpose of the diet was to first and foremost lose weight! The sore knees, sore back, sore hips, the fatigue, had to go. It took about five months for me to actually notice a difference. Slowly most things started feeling better. Changing old habits wasn't as a big deal as I thought it was going to be. There are a number of ways to reawaken to our lives and diet is a good one, I think.
Yeah, alcohol is way overrated, lol. I doubled my intake when I started dating the SO. Her job is extremely stressful, and she admittedly uses it to escape at the end of the day. And I enable that. Do I need a beer at the end of a hard day? Of course not. No more than I need to pull on my pecker to relax. We create the need by feeding the habit that reinforces the perception that we need it. So then we "need" it because in its absence we don't know what to do with ourselves. Anyway, yes, I need to cut my intake in half, at least. If I have one drink with dinner, I don't usually wake up feeling fuzzy. Two drinks isn't a good idea.
I eat less than I used to, and am trying to exercise regularly, though that last one has been difficult for me.
Anyway, your point is well taken. My performance issues always, always happen after I've had at least 2 drinks. Now, I've performed in the past under those circumstances, but why contribute to the problem when I know something has to change?
Honestly, you are doing really well. Cast your eye back to a year ago and your progress has been steady.
The point of my last message was that by taking away certain things we are actually adding to our lives. Shifting the paradigm, even just a little, changes so much. I am essentially still the person who cheated on his wife, engaged in PMO, and ate himself into oblivion every day, but along side that more of me is fleshed out. It's the atrophied bits that need our love, patience, and attention.
Well, my relationship is still suffering mightily from my inability to have successful sex. She is almost ready to throw in the towel. I peeked yesterday morning, which of course didn't help my mental state and confidence going into last night. Saturday she wasn't feeling well, so last night was "date night". Those words have a heavy weight for both of us now.
Other than the necessary step of changing our lovemaking routine, which I expressed to her again last night, I have to do my part much better and finally put a stop to my self-destructive behavior. It blows me away how I keep doing things I know I must not do. She wants and needs me to be forthcoming and honest with her, and I have not come through on that. Fear of losing her is driving that, but I can't keep using that excuse.
Since my issue is 100% psychological (OK, maybe 95%, since the alcohol doesn't help), it's all about me being clean, really clean, and knowing in my heart that I'm doing what I need to do to recover and be the partner we both want me to be.
Moz - sorry to hear that Man. Have you tried just taking a break from penetrative sex? Oral, fingers and massage can be pretty damn erotic. low lights, candles, soft music etc.
At least shows you are trying in other ways too.
Been peeking far too much myself lately. I admit as I am sure you know as well - it can be bloody compulsive.
But keep fighting the fight. I believe in you buddy!
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