Document the Victory

Discussion in 'Ages 40+' started by realness, Jul 7, 2020.

  1. forlorn

    forlorn Well-Known Member

    Oh, that would drive me mad. The hoarding of all that unnecessary stuff (I feel stressed just reading about it) - but as you say, certain circumstances and time pressures have made it difficult for her to address the issue. Could you try approaching it in a way where you inform your wife that you're planning to go to the recycling centre on 'x' date to get rid of some of your own stuff and ask if there's anything else she wants you to take?
    Or maybe you chunk the task down into smaller elements to make it appear manageable - could you both set aside some time to start 'organizing' the stuff - perhaps start by putting all the things she definitely wants to keep to one side.
    realness likes this.
  2. Rudolf Geyse

    Rudolf Geyse Well-Known Member

    @realness I can relate somewhat - my parents-in-law just about lost their house to hoarding as well. It's a real problem that may require some professional psychological help, which she may resist as well out of fear that the counsellor would tell her to get rid of everything. I hope you can continue to navigate this problem with patience and love and find helpful constructive ways to deal with the stress!
    realness likes this.
  3. realness

    realness Active Member

    thanks guys. I've tried to gently approach things and break down the tasks of purging our home. Usually it leads to a disagreement about discarding something and I back down and retreat. Or we make some progress and then I go passive for a long time and PMO and things build up again. That's one of those subtle effects of PMO that you don't realize over time. This has all gone on too long and one of the benefits of my recovery is I have more self respect/confidence, energy and boldness to not let it go on any longer. Yesterday she brought up some activities and commitments she is interested in outside of the home. She's been a stay-at-home mom for 8 years now and it's reasonable for her to go for things like this. But not with our house the way it is. It's a good opportunity for me to address this and be firm that our house needs to be in order before she can dedicate herself to outside pursuits.

    I've wanted to binge and PMO and relapse for a few weeks now. When the urges come up I've been able to pull back after thinking of the wreck I'll be afterwards. I've often settled for MO or FMO to get by. This morning I woke up and started to MO. But I stopped knowing that it will power me down. It will steal from my energy, self confidence, self respect, and my ability to serve and love others. I won't bring up any issues with my wife or stick up for myself. I'll take the short-term easy path of avoiding conflict, work and accomplishing things and just get by as issues pile up around me. Nope. None of that. I've had tastes of victory and accomplishments and I want more.
    Rudolf Geyse likes this.
  4. Rudolf Geyse

    Rudolf Geyse Well-Known Member

    Like with PMO there is a deeper root cause behind the hoarding. It could be that she wants to keep control in a situation which makes it tough to have control over anything - 4 kids etc (I have 4 and it can be chaotic to say the least). So by having each particular item she feels like she has something in her life that she can master, and it would therefore be very difficult to part with... or maybe I'm wrong and it's some other issue.

    In the same way that most of us on this forum researched our issues and came to some helpful conclusions, it may help to research the psychology of hoarding and see how to support someone who battles with this?

    Really all the best there and I hope it comes right.
    realness likes this.
  5. Saville

    Saville Well-Known Member

    Yes it is!

    This is a controlling statement. None of us get to decide how the other will live, nor what will be beneficial for them. Having a life outside the house, and all that means, might very well give your wife the motivation to get rid of a few things.

    Most men, at some point in their lives, want to get rid of all the clutter. Most women want to hold on to it. Guess what? That's fine! We don't have to agree on what shit to throw out. Men want get rid of the clutter because they believe it will magically transform something within. "I will have room to do this and that and the other!" The truth is, it isn't the clutter of our houses that is a problem, but our minds.

    You have done, and are doing, great work realness. Allow your wife the same latitude that you would like for yourself.
    positivef and realness like this.
  6. realness

    realness Active Member

    You're right, it is controlling to be conditional and demanding to my partner. I don't think I meant to express myself that way. So I'll be cautious and slow in how I'm dealing with this challenge. And this is a good reminder of the grace my wife has extended to me regarding my weaknesses that really offended her.

    I'll clarify that our "stuff" issue isn't just a matter of preference or a matter of us being better organized. It's a matter of entire rooms being unusable. Of parts of our home being blocked like desks and file cabinets, that has a domino effect of more stuff cluttering other areas of our home because we can't access storage or other spaces where it should go. My wife is in agreement that this needs to change, but for a long time has felt helpless and overwhelmed. And it's understandable that she feels that way. But it is unreasonable for us to stay that way. And that is my challenge as the man and husband in this home: how do I encourage and help and accomplish the goal of improving our home to make it effective at housing us and 4 kids?

    So, things are on a good path. We miraculously got a date night recently when some friends volunteered to come over and watch the kids for the evening. We had a good time and we were able to talk about the opportunities available to my wife. I expressed my support for her, but also expressed my concern about our house really being in trouble. I was able to do that in a positive, encouraging way, while also not being passive and eager to avoid conflict. It went really well! We agreed that next month we'll work together to purge and improve our home to put our family in a good position for my wife to spend more time outside of the house. I know that the actual purge will have some challenges. But I'm so happy that we were able to communicate well about it all. This was big for me, as this issue was one that I allowed to harden my heart with resentment, anger and frustration fueled by my unhealthy coping with PMO.

    I'm still struggling with psubs and fmo, but today will be 2 days complete with none of that, to go along with 53 days of no P or PMO binges. Recently the clothes dryer died, the family van needed new tires, we've needed a plumber for some issues, work has been crazy busy with non-stop fires to put out, and it's all felt overwhelming at times. But how wonderful to not cope with PMO. It's been great to rise to the challenges and love and serve my family well. There have been breaks and rewards, like a good latte at the coffee shop, and an amazing lunch at a hole-in-the-wall Mexican restaurant run by a kind and humble family. I am grateful for those good times.
    Saville, positivef and Rudolf Geyse like this.
  7. realness

    realness Active Member

    Getting hit by some strong urges and memories of some favorite P stars. The house is empty and I can choose to indulge and get a few hours of euphoria. And then stumble, checked out and in brain fog and shame, and muddle through some truly fun holiday plans over the next few days leading up to Christmas eve and Christmas with the family. On paper it's so not worth it, but with my weak brain it's a bad decision that I've made before and could make again. So here I am.

    The "No" muscle has been exercised today and I hope it's stronger for next time.

    The good and the bad of the holidays are in play. The wife is exhausted and certainly not open to intimacy right now. The house clutter situation is even more stressful as the house is getting inundated with new presents to wrap from family. There's no good places to put the kid's boots, mittens and snow pants they're using to play in the awesome snow we've been getting in our small-ish house. The kids are in mid-transition on clothes due to size and the season changes, so there's totes full of clothing to either be stored or donated. The totes are in the way of windows so I can't open and close curtains. Donated in our house means months of purgatory as the wife is either legit unable to keep up with it or unable to make quick, proactive decisions. It's all building up and it takes self awareness and work to cope with it in a healthy way. When my wife denied sex last night I think I did a good job of just listening to her and letting her vent it out all the stress. The clutter and work bothers her too. I needed to hear that as I often process it as a hurtful thing she's doing to me on purpose, which is simply not true. We settled on the action of setting up a night each week for her to get out and away from her responsibilities so she can get some rest and a regular break. I get that on Tues nights with my recovery group. Glad we made some progress on that.

    I'm looking forward to a purge and reorganization of our house in mid-Jan. I'll need to set up a child care option for the kids for a weekend. A place for all 4 of them to go for both Saturday and Sunday, otherwise we'll surely fail and get little/nothing done.

    Awesome, I didn't PMO. I'm off to get a few stocking stuffers for my wife. There have been past Christmases where her stocking was empty because it's a detail thing I ignored. I'm glad to be on my game this year and have found a few simple things to love her in that way.
    Rudolf Geyse likes this.
  8. Rudolf Geyse

    Rudolf Geyse Well-Known Member

    I definitely need to exercise that "No" muscle for fantasy. It's starting to atrophy over the last couple of weeks.
    realness likes this.
  9. realness

    realness Active Member

    Full off/on relapses before and after Christmas. There was a lot of time I was just checked out of things. This isn't the man I want to be, not the man I enjoy being. Back here again to mark a return to the right path.
    positivef and Rudolf Geyse like this.
  10. Rudolf Geyse

    Rudolf Geyse Well-Known Member

    If you go after the right path long enough, I believe you'll get it. All the best
    realness likes this.
  11. realness

    realness Active Member

    I've been on this site a lot the past two weeks enthralled with some amazing journals full of wisdom, transparency and real life. I'm carving out time now to update my journal and participate with others on theirs.

    I can't really make sense of the past month. It was bad in that I went full binge over the holidays. I bought a cheap tablet to act out on with PMO binges. It was ultimately unsatisfying and I returned it. I confessed this to flesh and blood brothers in my life group last night and I am confessing it here. But things have been really good too as I am now strong in my commitment to resume recovery. Intimacy with my wife has exploded in the past 4 weeks. Something clicked in my head and all I want to do is bang my wife. I've tried new things with her and discovered the thrill of the chase again. I've been blind to how lazy I have been about pursuing her. As an example, it's challenging to be intimate in the winter with our old drafty house. Our bedroom is one of the coldest rooms. Why haven't I thought of getting a space heater and warming up the room in anticipation of asking my wife to come to bed with me before? Because I was blinded by PMO. So a few days ago I got the heater going after we got the kids down to bed and lit a bunch of candles and told my wife I wanted her to come to bed with me. It was awesome! I can't stop thinking about that time and I can't wait to do it again and get a good pounding going again! That's all my sexual energy now. Looking back, this has all been months in the making. She changed over the summer and has lost almost 40lbs in 7 months. I've been changing and I put a ton of effort into a big milestone birthday for her that we celebrated in NOV. We've been feeding off of each other's energy and there's momentum to continue.

    It feels too easy to just resume recovery mid-stride like I have, but I'm not going to overthink this thing. My brain is in a great place where PMO is just so obviously an unfulfilling option. It would be so much better to have my cock in my wife, her tits in my mouth, and getting as worked up and sweaty as possible. My challenges now include managing that sexual energy well. When sex isn't possible, I have to find other ways to use that energy or hold onto it until I can have sex. This is a new challenge since I've been so lazy and weak for so long. My insecurities have still come up when I feel like I'm not getting reciprocal energy from my wife and I am the one initiating intimacy and closeness all the time. I get sucked into the hidden agendas, strings attached and covert contracts that I create in my weakness. For this stuff, I'm so grateful for the wisdom from other men here. I'm emerging from nice guy syndrome. I have better tools and knowledge to be healthy. I'm worthy of love and respect from my wife and those around me. I can say directly what I am feeling to my wife and there is no need to try and please her or anyone else around me. I have safe places like this one and my guys life group to delve into the more personal struggles and weaknesses that I'm purging from my life. This stuff takes time, but it's so worth it. I can weather the set-backs and challenges that will come along the way and I'm strong and able to resist the cheap alternative of PMO that hurts me the most.
  12. realness

    realness Active Member

    Had a babysitter come and enjoyed a dinner date with the wife yesterday. Got a nice walk in with her beforehand and got to listen to what was on her heart and some frustrations she's having with some friends. I was proactive and found a kind older woman from church to stay over night in a few months so my wife and I can have a hotel overnight. I'm so jacked up looking at hotels and finding something with a hot tub. Kissing my wife, holding her, finding the next opportunity to get naked with her, it's all awesome and so thrilling to be on the chase. I feel young again. Doing those things feels like it did when we were dating. She's asked about this change and where all of this is coming from. It's led to some good conversations.

    Today is one week from PMO. I MO'd 5 nights ago as I was wanting sex bad with the wife and chose not to hold out. Not a success, that's not how I want to handle my energy. The next night I scored intimacy and sex with the wife and since then, no O. Today I'm feeling the energy so I'm using it to come here, do push ups, and will tell my wife tonight clearly and tactfully that I desire her and want her.
    CleanBootsBaby! and StarWarsFan like this.
  13. CleanBootsBaby!

    CleanBootsBaby! Well-Known Member

    Man, that is as real as it gets :D. Great job!
    realness likes this.
  14. realness

    realness Active Member

    it's a rough day today at home. School for the 2 oldest kids switched suddenly to remote learning due to COVID for today and Monday. I got the pre-schooler out for her class this morning and came home with her mid-day to a clogged toilet, a defiant second grader, a cooperative first grader, a screaming 2 yr old, and a exhausted-zombie-megabitchy wife who took some of her frustrations out on me. I got the toilet going and helped with lunch. I made it a point to take care of my family but not fawn over my wife and fall over myself to make things better. I was treated like crap when I got home, and while I understand why she did that, it will need to be addressed and not just glossed over. I have to value that in order to value myself. That's my step one in handling this all in a healthy way. Coming here is step two, step 3 is some pushups, and that will launch me back to my job in being diligent and give momentum towards being productive at home and taking care of my family when I log off of work.

    So many times shit like this would happen and I'd switch right on to resentment, and entitlement to self-sabotage with a huge porn binge to feel better for a bit. Fuck that. I'm taking care of myself, expecting an apology from my wife, and moving on to things that have value.

    Thanks for your encouragement CleanBoots! I asked for sex and didn't get it last night. It kinda adds to the sucky day and can lead me down the self pity path of this all sucks, there's no sex or reward, blah blah blah. Lies. I make choices and the things I can't control I still make choices in how I react to them. I'm really excited for you and your future. Addressing PMO now before you have a partner? Damn, that's a huge move of health and strength that will save you heartache bro. With interest in my wife rekindled, I was looking at older pictures of her and saw her young beauty and hotness and knew that at the time of that photo, I was stuck in PMO and didn't appreciate and enjoy her as I should have. I really missed out which is sad. Thankfully I can learn from that, not dwell on it, and I've been granted today and likely a lot of tomorrows to savor my blessing.
    Rudolf Geyse likes this.

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