159 of NoFap, or I'm in a serious withdrawal or NoFap is useless? DP/DR

Discussion in 'Pornography Addiction' started by Doct0r, Aug 2, 2014.

  1. Doct0r

    Doct0r New Member

    25 y/o male, started fapping at 12 years. Last weeks, I don't feel anything good besides depressive thoughts and anxiety.

    The reason I started fapping is anxiety, panic attacks, depressive thoughts about meaning of life and reason to live.

    Did 159 days of NoFap from the first try, it was easy, didn't had big urges, maybe because I have a wife with who I have sex and chill myself.

    Why I don't feel right about NoFap ?

    Before NoFap:
    -Panic attacks
    -Anxiety
    -Depressive thoughts, reasoning life and why I should live
    -Was feeling joy and loved to do what I love
    -Sex was much longer because I was masturbating, and my wife had 1-3 orgasms when we had sex.

    During and after NoFap:
    -Mild anxiety
    -No panic attacks
    -Depressive thoughts
    -Don't feel joy anymore, and I don't love so much what I love to do, I just do it....
    -Sex is VERY short, around 1 or maybe 2 minutes. I don't feel her getting orgasms at all, and that kills my selfconfidence and makes me again depressive.


    Maybe this is how I should feel, maybe this means normal, with low normal doses of dopamine but I'm overreacting to it? Or my receptors broke down and I will never recover or what?

    I really think of going masturbating, without porn, just to last longer in sex with my wife. I did Kegel and all that type of exercise and I now all the breathing techniques etc, but these doesn't help so much when your brain is sensitive...

    So, what should I do?
     
  2. Psalm Reborn

    Psalm Reborn New Member

    Re: 159 of NoFap, or I'm in a serious withdrawal or NoFap is useless?

    Have you worked on your hobbies and what you want to do with your life? Or do you just sit around thinking about how depressed you are and about nofap all day? The problems won't be resolved with nofap.
     
  3. Doct0r

    Doct0r New Member

    Re: 159 of NoFap, or I'm in a serious withdrawal or NoFap is useless?

    I don't have hobbies. I know what I want to do with my life. I have goals. I workout in my free time, gaining some weights. But yeah, when I sit at the computer I think how depressed I am, and why I last only 1 minute in sex. Sometimes I even get so obsessed thoughts like "i bet she thinks about her other relationships when she had normal lasting sex..." Fuck, i sound like a cuckold.
     
  4. What Addiction

    What Addiction New Member

    Re: 159 of NoFap, or I'm in a serious withdrawal or NoFap is useless?

    Maybe the problem isn't NoFap. Maybe it's just what's left of you after you've Rewired your brain.
    Also did you do a 1-5 month period of no PMO or M/O what so ever. Making a mental change to stop O for many months and including all kind of semi sexual things like looking at bikini videos, starring at womans' body parts, starring at your own body parts.

    Maybe try several months or probably much less with No orgasm, live like the ONLY thing sexually you do is intimate relaxing bonding with your wife. Either that or maybe it's just a deeper issue beyond just not fapping.

    Going NoFap for 159 days is fine... but its a much bigger process in spectrum then just saying I'll stop whacking it myself I'll let me wife do it. It seems it's a NO artificial sexual Stimulation - No PMO and for many no M or M/On and either no O with a partner.

    There is LOTS you can for your body/mind. Exercise,sleep,diet, passions, fun.
     
  5. auzzie_mikey

    auzzie_mikey Well-Known Member

    Re: 159 of NoFap, or I'm in a serious withdrawal or NoFap is useless?

    Hey Doct0r,

    I'm in a very similar situation like you man. I previously had a completely clean PMO streak of 96 days, and now currently on a no PMO streak of 27 days. I feel emotionally numb with everything I do in life. I don't experience any emotions or happiness I use to experience in life anymore. My social anxiety is quite bad and confidence is much lower than usual. When I talk to friends, I can sense that I am not communicating/acting normally like I did before. That anxiety/mental block is there.

    When I say emotionally numb, when something says something funny, I won't find it funny. When a hot girl talks to me, I don't feel anything, just feel like I'm progressing through life like a zombie right now to tell you honestly.

    A lot, trust me ALOT of guys on here have said the experiences that we are currently facing are extreme withdrawal symptoms which are suppose to occur for up to 1 year. It can take up to 2 years for us to recover and get back to 100%.

    I am sticking to 100% no P, no MO, no sex until I recover 100%, so there can be no excuses as to why I don't recover quick enough. People on these forums argue that masturbation without P is fine, and then they keep complaining why their symptoms and their life isn't returning back to normal.

    This may sound hard to do, but if you want fast and quick recovery I suggest follow this no PMO on hardmode. I am completely staying away from all sexual thoughts, girls, masturbation for this period. I am not saying to stay away forever, but I want my normal self back first, before I can take part in such activities.

    Hope this helps
     
  6. Doct0r

    Doct0r New Member

    Re: 159 of NoFap, or I'm in a serious withdrawal or NoFap is useless?

    I have such a feeling that this will never go back. I mean will never recover, just get used to this numbness.

    I really miss my old perception of the world.

    I really don't know if jerking off again will return me back. Don't want to risk. But I never heard someone, who started PMO too early, to tell that he get through this and now he's 100% fine and his emotions, perception and joy is full 100% normal.

    I have these doubts. I don't know how to explain to some people how I perceive the world last months. It's like you are in the game, but not playing. People ask you something, but you feel like answering by instinct, you can remember something, read, concentrate, think but it's a strange feeling of you not being you, it's like depersonalisation/derealisation.

    Everywhere on the internet, says that this DP/DR is a symptom caused by anxiety, the brain is trying to escape the threat by getting out of the world. Since when I started to have these sensations, even if I beat anxiety and I'm 90% calm in any circumstances, I never managed to feel real 100% me.

    The strangest part is when I watch a touching video with people rescuing other people or pets, I can start crying. When someone tells a good joke, I laugh and it's funny. I feel sometimes the joy and maybe some sort of happiness but my brain instantly throws me thoughts like : "Hmm, is this joy same like the old one? I think this is DP/DR" It's like a bad habit, a bad mindset.

    Maybe I get rid of anxiety and depression, but my brains bad habit of thinking about this and recalling memories about how I felt, how I feel, and trying to overthink how I feel at the moment, puts me in a DP/DR mode.


    I hope there are people that are understanding me.



    Maybe all this time when i was PMO-ing, my body was always full of dopamine, joy, happiness and now after 12 years of fapping, I cut it , the brains sees the real world, but because of low dose of dopamine , I feel this world very threatening and sad, and that puts me in Dp/DR to get my away from the false threat?


    How can I test myself to see if this is how i should feel, or I'm low on dopamine. Is there a quick test or something, like trying to eat a chocolate to rise your dopamine levels or don't know.


    My biggest fear is that I will not recover, my dopamine receptors are burned down, my brain is already matured, gone through puberty and will not change back anymore even it's very plastic, and I will live with DP/DR forever, not feeling joy and happiness.

    Even when I try to think about people in africa that are happy with just playing with a stick, and me who is having all I need, all I want and I'm not happy. I think that I would pick first. It's insane to live when you don't feel joy, it's like just surviving.


    And I will never use antidepressants.
     
  7. fflatline

    fflatline New Member

    I feel the same way im getting sick of flatline my penis being shriveled and and my emotions coming and going. But i cant give in and ive abstained for 100 days
     
  8. Andress

    Andress New Member

    You havent seen anyone because only about 2% of the people here succeed on a normal reboot(3-9 months).If people cant do a short reboot like that imagine the ones who take +1 year of recovery.I only know about 1 person that had withdrawals for so long and recovered.He stopped having them after 1 year an he was completely recovered on the 2º.
    Im going on the same road.Im close to 11 months and still have them.
     
  9. Panonymos

    Panonymos Humility is a virtue

    Doctor, your issues will not be solved with a reboot. You need psychotherapy. Don't waste your time and go see a psychologist.
     
  10. toxicviper23

    toxicviper23 Guest

    Did you read the thread Gary Wilson just posted?


    There was a guy in flatline for 2 years before everything started clearing up and going good.



    There is no reason you should feel those feelings naturally. I would bet it's part of a post-acute withdrawal. Just keep going man, your getting regular sex with your wife so it isn't some hormonal thing.



    It will take awhile for your brain chemicals to get balanced.

    PMO is more of a drug than people realize. It's like a combination of your body's natural cocaine and heroin.
     
  11. ev426

    ev426 Member

    Re: 159 of NoFap, or I'm in a serious withdrawal or NoFap is useless?

    I just want to inform you that you're not alone and I feel EXACTLY what you're feeling, heck even your example about africa is the same that I came up with!!!!!! lol
    There's a 100% match between what you've described and what I'm going through. Now, I'll ask you this. Do you track your progress? From time to time I write down how I feel like. Sometimes I get moments of lucidity and I get, what I identify as ''6.5 out of 10'' days which is for me real decent compared to my normal state that I'd give a 3..And that seems to be promising.

    We and by that I mean people relating, don't have too many options. We've got to fight and stay strong. Dedication, desire, perseverance, hard work, focus and patience. You need to STRIVE for an optimal you and the only way of achieving so is doing EVERYTHING we could to reverse damages here's what I'm gonna commit to including obviously a complete abstinence from any sexual activity:

    - REGULAR exercise (minimum 3 days a week)
    - No junk food (calorific, bad fats, and sugar)
    - No alcohol, nicotine and any types of drugs
    - No weird medical pills such as L-dopa or wtv (except omega-3'S and vitamins, YOU NEED THAT GO GET IT)
    - No lusting at every women you happen to meet across --> a complete mental shift regarding how you perceive girls.
    - Trying meditation (Basically conditioning yourself to relax and keep calm)
    - No artificial stimuli video games
    - HEALTHY and BALANCED DIET of course, you are what you eat.


    If you feel hopeless and desperate, now you have something to work on. That's what at least I'm trying. It's a hard battle, it's not easy. We can't go back and change the past but what other options we got.

    Some brains are more stubborn then others. And some people got more affected by years of PMO then others.

    Medicine isnt that promising and a shrink will mostly prescribe depression and some other shitty pills that will fuck your head up even more. Don't try to do more stuff that you would regret after. Taking anti depressants might be a bad decision for us ex-PMO addicts.
     
  12. auzzie_mikey

    auzzie_mikey Well-Known Member

    This is probably my longest post I have done on this forum, but I really want to emphasise how much this problem affects me. Its not a thing that just stays there and I forget about, it starts from when I wake up to first check if I am mentally feeling better, to keep checking throughout all of the day.

    This is how my journey started. From 4th Feb - 9th May 2014 I went for about 93 days of absolute strictly no PMO, and absolute no masturbation. I was completely clean and did this perfectly well on hardmode. For the first 45 days, things were amazing, I was completely 100%, my confidence, my social ability with friends was completely perfect. Things started to take a shift on Day 45, when I had my first wet dream on 23rd March 2014. Since 23rd March I have never returned to 100% at all, even today I am not 100%.

    I feel mentally clear somedays, mind is clear, like I get a feeling that I am okay today, but then when I communicate with friends, social anxiety kicks in. Since 23rd march, there has not been even 1 day where I have had confidence or have been able to communicate clearly to a single person.

    I was one of the happiest people on this Earth, before this problem happened. People always used to ask me why I am so energetic, upbeat and alive all the time. I would always crack funny jokes and stay light-hearted all the time. Not only that, I was extremely confident in my self, my self-esteem was high and girls used to find me attractive, as they would always hit on me. After, march 23rd, all these happy moments completely disappeared. I felt like a zombie, just on auto-pilot. anytime I would talk to someone, I had to think really hard before saying something. Before it was natural, could do it subconsciously.

    Doct0r, your brain is not trying to overthink it. Because I always try to be confident when I tAlk with someone these days, But i physically cant. that mental block is there. When talking to someone, I say weird things now, and I can just feel the other person thinking "my gosh he isnt smooth on talking and hes on low confidence".

    Its exactly what I feel. How I perceive the world, is you only say something because you remember it, you are not saying it like its you. like you have to really think hard before saying it.

    another thing I feel is I dont know how to act normally in public now. Whenever I will stand still, or sit down on the seat and wait for the train, I find it really hard just to act normal. Like if I stare, I cant just look normally at people. Times that I have done that, i just end up staring into one spot, and realise few minutes later, wow, ive just been staring there. I always need a phone or newspaper so I feel people cant sense my weakness and dont judge me.

    Another thing is, I am really sensitive these days, like u said doctor. when i hear a bad story, i really feel the emotions. I am really sensitive now.

    Lastly, it affects everything I do in life. For example, when I try to study these days, I have to read something multiple times to digest and understand the information. before, i could get it instantaneously. theres a huge, marked difference in my perceptions and ability to comprehend things now.

    It affects my speed in doing things. The other day being called slow by your dad is what really made me sad. No one understands these things, I just see all the people around me and ask god, wow, all these people are doing normal things, what have I done that is bad? everyday I just look and try to search for my old self.

    for this reason, I always say to people on here that completely staying away from pmo, masturbation, any sexual activity is so important for a period of time. People always try to justify that masturbation without p is alright. Fine then, do it and see where it leads you. I am so desperate to get my 100% self back, that I am ready to do anything and stay away completely from sexual arousal/thoughts, so I can leave no excuse as to why I dont recover in the long term.

    cheers

    hope that helps
     
  13. Doct0r

    Doct0r New Member

    Yeah...amazing, but want more details from him.

    Basically I do all the stuff you mentioned, except meditation. Last weeks I don't do meditation, didn't had time to do it.
    And yeah, we don't have a choice, jerking off I think will not be a good idea, so we just have to stay strong. Maybe our eyes were blind with PMO, but now when we are out of it, we see how useless are we now, and we need to DO something to not get depressed, because just trying finding solutions to it without doing something will not give us nothing.

    I'll try finding some hobbies... but I still hope I can get my "perception" back.


    Same shit here. Hope it will get away.




    You know what's the weirdest thing during my 160 days journey, before NoFap? : I never had erectile problems, like a dead mojo, or flat penis, or no morning wood. My penis was, from day 1 to day 160 always rock hard. The only change is that now I cum like a fountain and the sex is much shorter, like 1-2 minutes, and that gets me depressed too. The only way I can last for ~5-7 minutes and give my wife some orgasm is the second sex. Even at the second time (around 15 minutes after the first one), my penis is still rock hard and can continue very well. And I get morning hard rock wood each morning, and even after napping during daytime. And my libido is always high. I can want my wife for 3 times a day, and get erection just by watching her in some bikini.
     
  14. It is so sad to read guy's stories here, but I'm in the same situation,
    I'm in this life like I don't want anything from this life. I'm kinda of a zombie.
    I don't even laugh at jokes. Being for too much in NO FAP, give me the sensation of an old man,
    no motivation in this life, I don't know what to do, all things I'm doing my brain throws me thoughts like I'm doing it wrong.
    My thoughts upon my reboot ->I have this "what if I'm not doing right" playing in my mind all the time.
     
  15. Re: 159 of NoFap, or I'm in a serious withdrawal or NoFap is useless?

    man I had these thoughts the same as you guys...
     
  16. auzzie_mikey

    auzzie_mikey Well-Known Member



    See man, that's why people like me and you are sensible, its much better to completely do no PMO on hardmode for a temporary period of time, so you can't have any excuses/reasons as to 2 years later as to why you didn't recover.

    It's kinda like we're just trying to survive life right now, in this horrible mindset and huge depression. Its kind of debilitating if you look at it, because we're like disabled to do so many normal things in life.

    It's not LIVING and enjoying life as such.

    The worst thing right now is, even to do basic things such as study, eat, gym, socialise are the hardest. Because the inherent desire is there in the body to do it, but once I start doing it, the motivation and horrible mental symptoms makes it really hard to be motivated. Its that I want to do them, but I sort of can't.

    I just think the best thing right now for all of us is, to FORCE ourselves to do basic things in life that will self-develop us, such as study, workout, eat well etc.

    Since, we're trying to survive we may as well just live a basic, yet fruitful life to the max. But I pray to god every single day that my condition improves

    Stay strong brothers.
     
  17. This is a hard journey of life. I searched for motivation so long(I'm tired of searching it), I motivate myself to do as little as I can, but at the end of the day or the next day I have an empty feeling like I don't have any fuel to go further, the motivation fades, I feel exhausted.

    I think we gonna soon reach a Buddha state of mind, wanting nothing in this life. His primarily teaching was > suffering comes from desires, but how can we not want smth in this life when around us life goes on? When all your friends achieve smth in this life, but you still try to find motivation when other guys do things from pleasure.

    And man, I don't know already what is the HARD MODE of NO PMO??? When I try my best, I fail... I try to be NO PMO, no lusting at females and every time I do, there must be a girl who remebers to write me, and this sets me horny... F*ck, I have to be 100% monk in a world where females are everywhere. Monk in my mind. Life is tricky, when you quit smth it throws you that what you wanted for whole your life.

    I think you guys got my point. Stay strong, or just accept the situation(tired of acceptance). May the knowledge be with you...
     
  18. toxicviper23

    toxicviper23 Guest

    .

    Dude, I've found this out the hard way. Rebooting takes a LONG LONG time! It's more of a serious condition than we realize.


    We have guys that felt fine PMOing, then found about NoFap from friend and just try it as an experiment. They get superpowers and feel out of this world!

    Then one day, WITHDRAWAL HITS, then everything comes crashing down and they feel way worse than before. This is a serious addiction. This is much more drug-like than most people are comfortable realizing.


    It takes a REALLY REALLY LONG TIME. You've fundamentally changed the way your brain functions. Your brain has literally built itself around getting PMO chemical hits at certain intervals. Your brain literally has to completely rewire itself.


    You WILL see benefits. I'm telling you, don't give up. Is there a way to practice sex with your wife more often so you can last longer?
     
  19. ANewPerson

    ANewPerson New Member

    Personally, anything longer than 6 months is too long for me to flatline... 1 year is definitely unacceptable and 2 years is laughable.

    I mean, people with bad drug addictions don't even flatline for that long. You can take Ibogaine and be completely fine the next day after being the worst heroin junkie. I'm pretty sure something else is going on here and I'm going to get to the bottom of it sooner or later.

    I'm a firm believer in Chinese Medicine and the energy system. If anyone has any interest, I highly recommend reading this great piece of work: Understanding and Treating Male Sexual Addiction Through Chinese Medicine:
    http://www.qingbai.nl/studiebordqb07/download/demo/070127ScriptieMitchellBridgmanAcupMaleSexualAddiction.pdf

    It's a heavy read and it would be best if you have some prior knowledge of Taoism, TCM or even Buddhism might help.. but there's a lot of interesting stuff in there.

    Here's a quote:

    Most of these characteristics can be elaborated upon by taking a closer look at the definitive recurrent behavioral pattern of the sex addict. The cycle begins with continual and progressive thoughts of sex, at least for several hours of the day, which create sexual arousal and tension. The arousal grows into uncontrollable urges and desire. To end the desire and release the tension created by the thought, the addict acts sexually, through whatever form of sex on which he is fixated. Release of this tension is usually followed by feelings of guilt, shame, and self-hatred, which almost always lead to an attempt to stop the behavior, ushering in a period of abstinence. This period may vary in length from a few hours to several years. However, the sexual thoughts invariably return, leading once again to uncontrollable desire and sexual action. Hence, the cycle continues, the resulting feelings of guilt, shame, and self-hatred increasing with each cycle.


    ....

    Stage 5: abstinence

    If one considers the stage of abstinence from sex to continue through the first and second stages of obsessive thought and craving, respectively, it may be considered to involve repression, or stagnation.

    As the Liver is responsible for the free circulation of Qi and Blood, especially in the Lower Burner, (30) it is immediately affected by repression, certainly by repression of sexual desires. Unfulfilled desires of any kind are the primary initial cause of Liver-Qi stagnation, which may also result from Liver-Blood or -Yin deficiency.
    Liver-Qi stagnation is also the central mechanism in the development of mental-emotional disorders. Any of the other ZangFu which are co-responsible for the development of these disorders will be negatively influenced by the Liver-Qi stagnation.
    Usually, the Spleen is the first to be affected, potentially leading to Spleen-Qi deficiency, Dampness, Phlegm, food stagnation, and/or Blood stasis. Spleen-Qi deficiency may subsequently lead to Lung-Qi deficiency, Heart-Blood and/or -Qi deficiency, and/or Kidney-Yang deficiency.
    Blood deficiency may further develop into a Yin deficiency. Liver-Qi stagnation may transform to Heat and ascend to harass the Heart Spirit. Transformative Heat may also develop and rise from Dampness, Phlegm, or Stomach food stagnation. Empty-Heat may develop from Kidney-Yin deficiency. (31) Furthermore, the Mind (Shen) may be obstructed due to stagnation of Liver-, Lung-, or Heart-Qi or due to Blood stasis in the Lower Burner. (32)
    The Mind may be Unsettled by Qi stagnation or Blood stasis or by Liver-Yin deficiency. (33) Any of these patterns of disharmony may be present in the cycle of sexual addiction, and most have been discussed in the categories of the first four stages of the behavioral pattern. What is important to consider is that abstinence, in so far as it may be equated with Liver-Qi stagnation, propagates the cycle of sexual addiction. It strengthens any of the possible pre-existing excesses of Dampness, Phlegm, Qi stagnation, Blood stasis, or Heat, and damages the ZangFu, leading to further deficiencies of Qi, Blood, or Yin.
    Classic texts warn that repression of sexual urges may cause accumulation of too much pressure and subsequent abscesses. (34) Prostate problems, termed ‘Buddhist Monk’s Disease’ in old China, were attributed to Jing becoming stagnant after not being circulated to its fullest potential.


    These problems can cause symptoms like depression, DP/DR etc.
     
  20. gameover

    gameover Age: 26

    Why if you do not have ED with your wife did you stop masturbating? 1-2 times a week masturbating is fine. The whole stopping masturbation thing is for guys with ED trying to recover.

    I mean your just fucking yourself up for no reason.
     

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